Good points well made, Tim.
Brian.
-----Original Message-----
From: Tim Fathers
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2017 9:35 AM
To: Rational Developer for IBM i / Websphere Development Studio Client
forSystem i & iSeries
Subject: Re: [WDSCI-L] RDi way ahead
It wasn't my intention to start an editor war, it was just a throw away
comment based on the aggravation levels I experience using the various tools
I do. Much as I like RDi compared to SEU, it's more brittle than the other
IDEs I use and creates more friction, that's my experience at least.
I'm sure the RDi team does a good job and I don't suppose any of the
developers went to their boss one day and said "You know how much we hate
our users right? Well, instead of just having our software install like any
other piece of PC software, why not create our own 'installation manager'
which we can use to make installation, updating and licencing really
painful, that will really antagonise them!" Or "Boss, you know how the IBM i
is struggling to attract new talent and persuade people to use up-do-date
tools, well why not raise the barrier to entry even higher by charging a
small fortune for them?"
Where I work we had a real struggle to buy RDi for the department, I don't
know what was paid eventually, but the initial quotes were into the high
tens of thousands of Euros for somewhere around 20 licences and as I
freelancer I forked out well over a thousand euros for my own copy (the
licencing for which is so complicated it's hard to even know what I
bought!). And that's without the cost of licencing the ILE compilers you
require to actually produce any code, without which RDi is just a very
expensive editor.
It seems crazy that I can rent access to an IBM i for a year for a fifth of
the price of an RDi licence to actually program anything on it. On the other
hand, the entire rest of our web app stack which consists of Angular,
Typescript, JavaEE etc., etc. is built using completely free tools. I truly
believe if IBM had open-sourced RDi or perhaps even had a free version with
basic source editing and a pro version with perhaps the local compilation
etc. then the uptake would be much greater.
Tim.
________________________________
From: WDSCI-L <wdsci-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx> on behalf of Brian Parkins
<goodprophet.bp@xxxxxxxxx>
Sent: 04 March 2017 18:55
To: Rational Developer for IBM i / Websphere Development Studio Clientfor
System i & iSeries
Subject: [WDSCI-L] RDi way ahead
Ooooh - this could an interesting discussion ...!
==========================
Except that neither Netbeans nor Visual Studio Code can handle IBM i
programs!
I was sort of interested in the 'way ahead of RDi' part.
Potential RFE material rather than editor wars :-)
But this is potentially changing:
<
https://github.com/NielsLiisberg/RPG-for-VSCode>
[
https://avatars1.githubusercontent.com/u/2787230?v=3&s=400]<
https://github.com/NielsLiisberg/RPG-for-VSCode>
GitHub - NielsLiisberg/RPG-for-VSCode: IBMi RPG language
...<
https://github.com/NielsLiisberg/RPG-for-VSCode>
github.com
README.md RPG README. RPG for IBMI is syntax for ILE FREE RPG from version
7.1 and above. Best regards. Niels Liisberg 2016. Known Issues. None so far
==========================
The RDi team do a fantastic job. Great product and support. Not perfect, but
subject to continual improvement; with our help, it can only get better.
(iSphere - we thank you!)
However, the Big Problems are, (IMHumbleO):
- The relatively small audience for RDi. (I imagine it is difficult for
Rational
to justify major investment in a niche product.)
- The cost of licences. (Difficult for some organisations and especially
individuals to
justify the outlay.)
This story has been heard many times before. I'll say it again
because my very recent experience with an IBM i client continues to
underline the issue of costs. Not being an IBM i customer myself, I cannot
say what level of discounts might be available, or what "trade-in" deals are
on offer. What I _do_ know is, the individual cost of 855UKP (Authorised
User with Perpetual Licence for 12-months) is just too much to swallow for
individuals and smaller teams. I am reliably informed that this price is not
much different, even with discounts and trade-ins of ADTS.
I know scores of IBM i developers who would _love_ to have RDi on their
workstations. Sadly, the costs kill the argument. This in turn is doing the
IBM i platform no good at all.
I've recently been playing around with the DBeaver SQL client tool. It is SO
good
and a dream to use with DB2 for i. It's based on Eclipse - and free. Then
there's the iSphere tooling. So maybe one solution is in our own hands, as
hinted at by the above Github link. Or maybe we should be supporting the
MiWorkplace project; licence costs appear to be 25.50EUR. Very attractive.
(Not as sophisticated as RDi - but an affordable option.)
I have no answers, I just know there are many RPG IV developers out there
who cannot get their hands on RDi because of the cost.
Brian.
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