I didn't put any words in your mouth. You said you had to learn a whole new
language, and
I said it's the easiest language to learn. That's not putting words in your
mouth.
It was the above statement that made me state you have your own ready made
realities. No name calling, just calling it as I see it. If it helps, it's
just my opinion :-)
What layers? EGL generates Java. The Java runs as a service responding to
URLs. How many layers is that?
You have the app server, you have the database connection pooling, you have
the ORM layer, you have the different JSF handlers, etc, etc, etc. Lots of
things we already have "built in" for us with RPG. That's the stuff I am
talking about.
Maybe this question we be the better way to approach it: If we could have
what we need to create modern UI's from RPG would you still be using
Java/EGL?
So how exactly is EGL doing it *without* hidden fields?
It's using SOA. No pretending to be a 5250. The business logic is just
business logic. That's the beauty of SOA.
What? That didn't answer the question at all. Look at the end HTML code
EGL (or rather JSF) produces and you will see a plethora of hidden fields.
Note that I don't think hidden fields are a bad thing, I am just challenging
you on your original statement.
How much work does it take to expose an RPG program as a service using
RPG-CGI?
Depends on what you are trying to do. Do you need an industry compliant web
service or one the conforms to a homegrown standard? Actually, either one
can potentially take less than 30 minutes and ALL the code is in RPG. Now I
will not argue that my approach takes tripple to quadruple the steps and
time to build the initial web service that EGL or other Java tooling does,
but to have it all written in RPG is priceless for future maintenance
because I am capitalizing on a shops investment in the iSeries and RPG. To
put proof in the pudding here is a 16 minute video showing how to create a
web service from scratch using Eclipse to build the WSDL and then RPG to
offer up the web service (yes it is using my product RPG-XML Suite which
makes it easier to parse, compose and transmit XML). Again, many more steps
than Java, but it didn't require a new business logic language to be adopted
nor did it alter their Change Management strategy (i.e. still just iSeries
objects), nor did they have to buy a bigger machine to support WAS and
instead can use the ever-solid-and-free Apache.
http://mowyourlawn.com/video/calcprice_from_scratch/calcprice_from_scratch.html
The above video was produced for a customer of mine that I just got done
doing two days of on-site SOA/webservices training in Vegas. They love it
because they have been told by IBM and Microsoft (and many others) that RPG
should only be used for business logic, but should eventually be phased out
for EGL/Java/C#.NET/VB.NET/PHP. My message is that you can make it (web
services and GUI applications) happen with RPG with not much more work -
that is priceless if you ask me.
You think Java/EGL is ok, and in the same email you state you have 30 years
experience of building these things. When are you going to realize that not
everyone has that!?!?! When are you going to realize that there is benefit
to staying with a single language as much as possible?!?! Note I am pro
using Java around the edges where RPG simply wont work, but to replace RPG
with Java/EGL in an area where it CAN compete is bordering on not
understanding where your IT shops resources are and where the direction
should go to gain the most ROI. If you were only catering to Java
developers stating that EGL is much better than Java I would say "Hey, he's
got a good point". But when you convey that EGL is going to be soooo easy
to modernize your iSeries RPG applications, I think you are mis-leading
people into something they shouldn't be entertaining until after they have
failed to do it with RPG.
Hopefully that helps you see better where I stand and where I believe you
stand (correct me where I am wrong),
Aaron Bartell
http://mowyourlawn.com
midrange.com
