Re: ADTS V6R1 - No SEU updates?

Joe,

I have to add weight to what Jon is saying. Some members of the Rational
team said they would review some ideas that were suggested to them - that
was true. However, since then, those same people have said things like:

Question from Mkirkpatrick: Are there any circumstances under which one is
entitled to copies of RDi or RDi-S? If not, what is the pricing?
GeorgeFarr says: No chance of entitlement. RDi and RDi SOA are NEW products.
RDi is $795.
(See: http://isociety.org/Chat20080206.html)

Repeat: George Farr said on Feb 6th that there is no chance of an RDi
entitlement.

Sounds different than what you keep saying. Listen to what Jon is saying -
he is on the money. Until the decisions are official, you may even be
breaching any NDA that you have.

The details of the message that you seem to have heard at "that meeting' are
often different than the details heard by many of the people who were at
that meeting. Your words since then have become an expression of what ~Joe~
thinks, rather than what has actually happened since then. Your mis-reading
of what Jon says is your usual approach, and it is sad that someone with
your amount of noise in the industry is talking his own opinion as though it
is fact. People who listen to you as though you are speaking fact are being
misled. Your words are simply opinion, and your opinion does not always
guide IBM's direction.

Joe, you are plain wrong in some of these cases. You have been proven wrong
in the past, and the crow must be tasting good to you. Your passion for this
platform aside, you must open your eyes wider, remove the ~Joe~ blinders you
are wearing, and start listening to what other people are saying. The one
common complaint you lodge against EVERYone on this list who does not agree
with you is that they are not reading what you are saying. This argument
seems to come from your familiarity with not reading what ANYone is saying,
and repeating your crow position over and over. Please stop slamming people
and start listening to them. You promised 2008 would be different, but you
are falling back into a very narrow and poorly defended position. Making a
lot of noise does not make your position correct - just loud.

Trevor




On 2/15/08 9:46 AM, "Joe Pluta" <joepluta@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Jon Paris wrote:

On 15-Feb-08, at 8:27 AM, wdsci-l-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:

Otherwise it's George
Farr and Todd Britton saying there will be an upgrade, and you saying
there won't be, and I think I'll put my money on the people who
work at IBM.

By selective quoting you just put words in my my mouth Joe. Your
quote ignored all of the rest of my note where I said (among other
things) that I was working for a change and hoped to see it. I was
merely pointing out that people at IBM telling you what their plans
are does not constitute "official" particularly until prices and
details are announced.

I think if we asked most folks on the list, they would say that you
don't think there will be an upgrade. I don't care how cleverly you try
to word your stuff, it's the intent of the words that matter. And
actually I was trying to be somewhat nice by not quoting the nasty
bits. But since you want to keep complaining, here's the ugly part that
I didn't quote, but I will now:

I worked for a number of years in the IBM Lab and lived daily with
the IBM pricing and packaging process. These things once set in
motion are not that easy to change. George could say that he was
going to make the change tomorrow and there are still many, many
other approvals that would be required before it happened - and
that's not even counting IBM legal!

In my opinion, you're spreading FUD, because your long-ago experiences
at IBM clearly have nothing to do with today's Rational group. They
weren't considering a trade-up until we brought it to their attention
less than 30 days ago, and they said they would do so. Your paragraph
above clearly implies that you don't think it's going to happen.

This is the part where you come up with yet another round of
double-speak about how that's not what you meant, but really, I don't
want to hear it. Go ahead, I won't reply.

And in case anybody missed the point, it's simple: IBM *will* provide a
trade-up. They said they would, I believe them, and now they've said it
offiicially.

I'm not on the rah-rah train, here folks. You know me, I call them as I
see them. And those who know me know I figured Rational would dump the
System i faster than you could say "flipping burgers". But the truth is
that for some time now I've seen nothing but a concerted effort to try
and address the issues of the System i community combined with an
agility typically unheard of in a company of IBM's size, and there
hasn't been a thing said to me by the Rational management that they
haven't come through on. In fact, they've been careful not to
over-promise; there's still one really big thing that I think they need
to come through on, but I can't discuss it until they make a formal
decision one way or the other. But they didn't just promise it to me to
shut me up; they said it was a good idea and they're working on it.

I've also been on the Rational beta team, and I've seen what they do to
work with the System i community. And I've spoken at the Rational
developer's conference and talked to the people there -- you'd be amazed
how many people care about our little platform. So at least right now,
Rational has lots of credibility with me. If April rolls around and we
don't see a good trade-up plan, I'll eat some crow and we'll move on,
but for now, I'm going to bet on IBM.

Joe