|
FYI, your wrong with this statement with respect to our situation:That
Just yesterday a comment on this list included "Retirement is just around
the corner." They hear "we're moving off the platform" and guess what!?
brush.should finish right about retirement. Perfect!
Here's the problem...there's a bunch of folks on this list who work in the
"consulting" world. That's great, I am happy for you and I'm sure you make
good money. But you should be careful about painting with such a wide
industries,
Those of us who are "peons", working in larger multi-million dollar
have no say whatsoever when C-level leadership changes and decisions aremade
that dictate a different IT direction. At this point, you can toss out anystaying
buzzword you wish as a reason for these changes...
In our case, there is no intermediate leadership that had the ability and
backing to "step up to the plate" and make a wild swing in support of
on this platform.DrFranken
Anyone who doesn't understand this level of political structure in the
"big business" world...really needs to get out a little more often.
I hope some of you are able to help save the smaller companies...before
they reach this level of ignorance with regards to a strategic direction.
-----Original Message-----
From: MIDRANGE-L [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 9:26 AMpush back
To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion; Nathan Andelin
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: Moving from Green screen app to GUI because of
list goes on and on).
Nathan makes some great points here. Allow me to elaborate.
> 1. A legacy database (e.g. dates stored as 5-digit numeric; the >
place? In THAT conversion many databases were updated, I participated in
True. And yet how many of these came from S/34 or S/36 in the first
challenging. It means thinking in ways the business demands, dare I say:
> 2. An application architecture that was resistant to change.
Again often true. But resistant doesn't mean impossible. It means more
"Outside the box?"a timely manner.
> 3. An IT organization who failed to respond to new requirements > in
one, but not the item, the sequence. THIS needs to be #1.
Shock and awe!! Frankly what did Nathan get wrong on this list? This
around the corner." They hear "we're moving off the platform" and guess
Just yesterday a comment on this list included "Retirement is just
broken heart. You can see when the staff has thrown that towel. They could
It is sad how often I have walked out of shops with effectively a
performance.
DON'T be that guy who gets a bronzed power cord.
- Larry "DrFranken" Bolhuis
www.Frankeni.com
www.iDevCloud.com - Personal Development IBM i timeshare service.
www.iInTheCloud.com - Commercial IBM i Cloud Hosting.
On 12/13/2017 7:56 AM, Nathan Andelin wrote:
Mark,
In fairness to Tim and other folks at IBM, it has been my experience
that when organizations migrate to Windows or Linux and Intel, it has
little to do with the fact that IBM hasn't provided a GUI, or bundled
it with the operating system. The real problem was that the
organization ran into constraints within (in order of priority):
1. A legacy database (e.g. dates stored as 5-digit numeric; the list
goes on and on).
2. An application architecture that was resistant to change.
3. An IT organization who failed to respond to new requirements in a
timely manner.
In regard to the IT people, the nail in the coffin that sealed their
fate was their proposal, or adoption of a screen scraper, and an
attempt to cover up the more relevant issues delineated above.
It had nothing to do with the cost of the screen scraper. It always
costs a lot more to migrate to Windows or Linux. In addition to the
migration cost, the ongoing operational costs are higher.
On Tue, Dec 12, 2017 at 8:39 PM, mlazarus <mlazarus@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Tim,
I was discussing this subject recently with a very respected member
of this group. We were both confused how turning over a crucial, and
I do mean crucial to the longevity of the system, piece of creating a
modern UI is turned over to third party vendors instead of being
fully integrated and included in the OS.
Some vendors have done an admirable job creating a product, but
IMHO, it's ridiculous to have to pay a large bundle extra to get what
should be included and easily integrated into the system. It is also
more expensive to develop using (at least) some of these tools. My
estimate is at least 25% longer to develop and test.
I have three clients that are jumping ship to a PC based platform,
another that has already gone in that direction (they used to have
the largest AS/400 config in the US northeast (which included 14
AS/400's) and another is in the midst of moving part of their
operation to a PC based cloud system. I haven't heard of a new
member to the midrange fold in a long time. I would imagine that
they exist, but I think that 20+ years after the GUI became popular,
for IBM not to include this required functionality, plus the GUI
development tools as part of the base OS, is just plain foolish.
No offense to the tool vendors, but I believe that this
functionality is best integrated at a low level in the OS, not as a
generic API in order to get the best integration, debugging and
interface is
-mark
On 12/12/2017 10:44 AM, Tim Rowe wrote:
Yes!! Moving from Green Screen to a Mobile or Web based
thatbeing requested by many. Not just your either. In todays world
its really
becoming a necessity. That is one of the reasons that the IBM i
team has
been investing in Open Technologies that are being created to
interface
with our existing back end programs. Its why we have REST Api
engines that
are delivered with the operating system. To allow our IBM i
customer to
move in to this 'normal' world. Not only do we have many options
provideallow you to do the work, we have a wealth of great ISVs that
i,tooling to help you make this transition in a fraction of the
time while
in many cases leaving your existing code virtually untouched.
If you are
interested in getting a view of some of these ISV, please send
me a note
and I can get you a list.
Or if you need more info on the options in the Open world for IBM
newplease let us know.
Tim
Tim Rowe, timmr@xxxxxxxxxx
Business Architect Application Development& Systems Management
for IBM i
IBM i Development Lab, Rochester, MN
(507) 253-6191 (Tie) 553-6191
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www-2D03.ibm.com
_systems_power_software_i_are_index.html&d=DwICAg&c=usKnhNfiA3SpEGkR
2TubeV6I5jE5rze8vzZE7OpWXXY&r=LD1savGZ6Gc4gIcG9yLPnyfe5Wy5IgPnRmF3qD
wpJN4&m=eS2plqaO94nexFvqYCol0sli5FOKUt7yF8V9D9cro18&s=IACtGsMYiPdcMo
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message: 2
date: Tue, 12 Dec 2017 12:19:29 -0300
from: Raul Jager<raul@xxxxxxxxxx>
subject: Re: Moving from Green screen app to GUI because of
push back
from younger employees?
Go ahead with the change.? Go to web.
We began the change 20 years ago. Some user where against the
andinterface, and we had to restrict the green screen, but when
we put it
back on, the users stayed with the web.
Once we learned to use the web, none of the programmers
wanted to do any
more green screen programs.? The web gives a lot of resources ,
willfrees from the limit in the size. You can replace one program
at a time,
and run "hybrid". Usually, by replacing just a few programs you
tasktake most of the work to the web.
We use CGIDEV2.? It replaces the "screen" with a "mask" in
html and the
RPG logic remains very similar.? (assuming you have small - one
employeeseach - programs)
A good web designer can do the "presentation" without knowing
RPG, and
you can use it with minimal web knowledge.? Basic html is
simple, but
not spectacular. Even so, it is better than green screen.
On 12/12/2017 11:04 AM, Ken Meade wrote:
> I had a request to update our interface from a green screen
application to
> a 'more modern GUI' because of an inability to keep new
morebecause
> of the look/feel of the green screen apps and the ability to
familiareasily
> train them if the look/feel was something they were more
kmeade@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx |with.
>
>
>
> I'm just curious if others have run into this as a reason to
'modernize'
> their applications.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ken Meade
>
> Director of Information Technology |
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__archive.midrange.com_mi> 603.444.3570 |--
>
> 1309 Mt. Eustis Road, Littleton, NH 03561
>
> microsoft windows sharepoint services logo
>
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