RE: "RPG isn't cool" (was: Re: IBM Secret) -- MIDRANGE-L

Both to accomodate people who prefer one method over the other.  For
position specific source entry I'm thinking of something like mutant tab
settings.  I avoided the use of "backward compatibility" for obvious
reasons. <g>

-----Original Message-----
From: Schenck, Don [mailto:Don.Schenck@WL.com]
Sent: Tuesday, May 11, 1999 10:20 AM
To: 'MIDRANGE-L@midrange.com'
Subject: RE: "RPG isn't cool" (was: Re: IBM Secret)


Joel --

Why have both???

With free-form, you DO have both worlds. There is NOTHING to prevent a
programmer from using columns in free-form code.

In fact, using columns to format the code is a GOOD idea; but you need to be
able to indent and other formatting options.

"Code Complete", which (IMHO) is THE book on code construction, mentions
code formatting in detail. Lots of good stuff.

Oh sheesh ... I'm back into the free-form discussions AGAIN! It's like a
time warp.

Peace,

-- Don "Warp? Hmmmm ... wasn't that an IBM product???" Schenck

-----Original Message-----
From: Joel Fritz [mailto:JFritz@sharperimage.com]
Sent: Tuesday, May 11, 1999 11:57 AM
To: 'MIDRANGE-L@midrange.com'
Subject: RE: "RPG isn't cool" (was: Re: IBM Secret)


I think a lot of it is what you're used to.  I can remember arguing with a
co-worker about the merits of free form (with eval) calculations vs RPG
Classic.  He claimed (and I believe him) that he could read a complex
calculation expressed in a sequence of add, sub, mult, div instructions with
a bunch of temporary variables as easily as the same thing in algebraic
notation.  I like free form, but RPG wasn't my first language.  What I'd
like to see is support for both free form and positional source. 

-----Original Message-----
From: Stone, Brad V (TC) [mailto:bvstone@taylorcorp.com]
Sent: Tuesday, May 11, 1999 6:18 AM
To: 'MIDRANGE-L@midrange.com'
Subject: RE: "RPG isn't cool" (was: Re: IBM Secret)


I understand your concerns.  I was just expressing what I would like.  I,
like you suggest, was trained in Modula-II, C++, etc.  I wasn't even shown
RPG until my last year of college, and then my internship.  I loved it.  And
it was right when RPG/IV was a very hyped new feature "coming soon!".
Needless to say, I couldn't wait.

The only reason i would like free format, long field names, etc, is because
they would make the code more self-documenting, to me at least.  (please, no
wars on self-documentation.)

Bradley V. Stone
Taylor Corporation - OASIS Programmer/Analyst   
bvstone@taylorcorp.com


> -----Original Message-----
> From: boothm@ibm.net [SMTP:boothm@ibm.net]
> Sent: Monday, May 10, 1999 7:12 PM
> To:   MIDRANGE-L@midrange.com
> Subject:      RE: "RPG isn't cool" (was: Re: IBM Secret)
> 
> Brad, I have wondered about this solution in context with another issue. 
> I have noticed that people with C++ training are either good and in the
> top 5% of their class or else not good enough to make a living as a
> programmer.  
> 
> RPG on the other hand is easy and clear enough so that almost anyone with
> the qualifications to get enrolled in a college's RPG class has a good
> chance of passing with good grades and getting a good job with a
> productive programming future.  In my opinion much of that characterisitic
> is due to the very nature of RPG's structure.  Therefore my conclusion is
> that free flowing form is not a plus for the middle and bottom of the bell
> curve.   RPG is not an elitist's programming language, it is a working
> man's tool. 
> 
> Spoken from somewhere in the middle of the bell curve.
> 
> 
> In <4EC96B864C1CD211BBC500805FE6FDBC1B4E13@tcexch1.taylorcorp.com>, on
> 05/10/99 
>    at 10:14 AM, "Stone, Brad V (TC)" <bvstone@taylorcorp.com> said:
> 
> >> Now, let's assume that being "cool" is a desirable
> >> quality in a programming language.  If we were to try to
> >> change RPG from an "uncool" language to a "cool" language,
> >> is there a single easy thing we could do to improve the
> >> language?
> >> 
> >[Bradley V. Stone]  Free format would be the biggest help.  Getting rid
> >of limits to sizes of file names, field names, variables, etc would the
> >the second.  
> 
> -- 
> -----------------------------------------------------------
> boothm@ibm.net
> Booth Martin
> -----------------------------------------------------------
> 
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