Re: frame question

Walden,

In a message dated 97-11-17 18:45:32 EST, you write:

> <snip>
>  >came from there, after monitoring traffic on _your_ server so they can
pop up
>  >a quick message like "For verification purposes, what was that credit
card
>  >number/password, again please?").
>  <snip>
>  
>  Hold on a sec. Let us look at the packet flow of a connection:
>  1) I connect to my ISP using my house phone line
>  2) I send my ISP a packet. (containing my credit card number)
>  3) The packet gets forwarded to my ISP's provider via T1, T3 or other
>  dedicated cable.
>  4) The packet travels on the backbone on fiber or really big cable.
>  5) The packet arrives at the Vendor's provider
>  6) The vendor's provider send to the packet to the vendor.
>  7) Done.
>  
>  Notice that my packet does NOT get sent to anyone else dialed into my ISP.

Perhaps I oversimplified the example.  I think your are missing 4.5 -- the
packet gets routed through (often several) nodes on the Internet.  "Major"
ISP's often have a direct connection to the vendor.  The smaller ISP's (or
those transactions entered via the WWW through an unsecure connection) _DO
NOT_ go straight to the vendor.

>  Now, where can someone "watch" my data? I doubt that anyone has the
ability
>  to hook into MCI's fiber between NY and Denver. And if they do, getting my
>  lowly credit card number is the last thing on their mind. They could hook
in
>  between the vendor's provider and the vendor, but again that would require
>  high-end equipment, not something your average credit card thief would
have.
>  So, if they are going to hook in, it would probably be between my house
and
>  my ISP. What a waste of time, the chances that a thief would ever find
>  anyone online are pretty small, and even if they did, they would have
tapped
>  in during a computer conversation. They would need a good amount to
>  equipment to interpret the data stream.

On any of these "intermediate" nodes.  AOL's excuse for my LISTSERV mail not
coming in in order any more is that they have "routed the mail through
several servers in order to increase efficiency, and some servers are slower
than others".  I will not pretend to know how this choice is made or how it
works.  All I know is that, as an Internet user, my mail _USED_ to come in in
order and now it doesn't.  It also tells me that my mail doesn't stay in
AOL's domain at all times.  What this tells me is that, ordering through a
supplier-ISP agreement is probably OK -- ordering via e-mail probably isn't.

>  On the other hand... You could walk into the switching station outside LL
>  Bean w/a hard hat, a clipboard and a telephone handset and listen to a
>  verbal communication very easily. As I see it sending credit card numbers
>  via the internet is safer than the voice calls I used to make.

And I couldn't do the same if I add a Notebook PC into the hardware list?
 Most telephone hardware requires them (a PC) these days...

Curious,

Dean Asmussen
Enterprise Systems Consulting, Inc.
Fuquay-Varina, NC  USA
E-Mail:  DAsmussen@aol.com

"I don't know the key to success, but the key to failure is trying to please
everybody." -- Bill Cosby
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