Re: RPG and AJAX was->RE: How do I create a webpagethat....

Joe,
>>My point is that AJAX is a technology looking for a reason.  
I'll refrain from my initial reaction to this comment, but in a nutshell, huh???

Before I rebut, let me say that I think JSPs with an RPG IV backend is the best
solution going today. Its not for everyone, but in my view it's the best one
around. But AJAX will compete with it, and to the point where in a year or less
I will probably replace my JSP/RPG perspective with AJAX/RPG.

Ajax has been around for years. It is just that an author (James Garrett) wrote
an article on it a little over a year ago and decided to coin the phrase AJAX.
Suddenly a light bulb turned on in everyone's head. Granted that bulb did not
make them AJAX experts, but at least it is helping to stir interest in GUI-izing
applications--specifically for the 400. 

The point about it being difficult technology is ridiculous. It is difficult but
if you're a programmer and not just a code-stealing-clerk you can figure it out.
APIs, C, MI and other things are complex too, and I see your point (or was it
Scott's) that the right tool for the right job should be advocated, unless it is
complex? 

Difficulty is the eye of the beholder. If I say that I don't advocate Java
because it is too complex, slow and resource hungry, Joe might think otherwise
because he's familiar with Java and lives with it daily. 
For me, CGI/RPGIV and now AJAX are where I live now and things aren't all that
complicated.

-Bob Cozzi
www.RPGxTools.com
RPG xTools - Enjoy programming again.


-----Original Message-----
From: web400-bounces+cozzi=rpgiv.com@xxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:web400-bounces+cozzi=rpgiv.com@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Joe Pluta
Sent: Friday, April 07, 2006 1:07 PM
To: 'Web Enabling the AS400 / iSeries'
Subject: Re: [WEB400] RPG and AJAX was->RE: How do I create a webpagethat....

> From: Bob Cozzi
> 
> Joe, what's your point? This is like saying the grass is green and the sky
> is
> blue. You can say this about everything, from JAVA/JSPs to RPGIV to CL to
> C/C++
> to Python to Perle to PHP.
> What's the point?

My point is that AJAX is a technology looking for a reason.  There just
aren't many places where it's really necessary.  Yet it will be overused
because right now it's bright and shiny.


> Ajax is here to stay it is the next cool toy/tool to play with.

Basically, this makes my point.  There is a certain class of programmer who
will push AJAX because it's cool, regardless of the utility of the
technology in the business case.  It's the new hammer syndrome.


> It will displace
> a lot of Java/JSPs that's for certain, but it will also enable people who
> shied
> away from the JSP or similar model to get into web development using just
> JavaScript and RPG IV (or pick the host language you prefer most).

I disagree.  Nothing in AJAX displaces JSP, since you can use AJAX in JSP.
In fact, AJAX is an interesting way to make use of integrating JSP and CGI.
Unfortunately what AJAX does is move server logic to the client by pushing
it into JavaScript.  Of all our currently available tools, JavaScript is by
far the hardest to debug.  Using it to turn a web browser into a thick
client is a bad idea except in those instances where you specifically need
thick client functionality.


> I see 80 percent of RPG IV code out there is poorly written due to rushing
> through it or perhaps indifference on the part of the programmer. I see
> this in
> most applications in other languages as well. "Make it work for my
> specific situation and nothing more."

This is a non sequitur.  Tailoring a design to a specific business
requirement does not lead to bad code. 


> I just helped out a hospital software company and the Ajax implementation
> of their hospital registration and lab coding software is killer now
> compared to the old green screens. And it runs faster!

And my guess is you could have done the vast majority of the code without
AJAX.


> Lest we forget--5250 use interactive CPW where as Ajax uses CGI which is
> batch CPW.

Bob, you're all over the map.  JSP is batch as well.  In fact, any HTML
generation short of the old WebFacing is batch.


Again, just in case I'm not being clear: AJAX is not a bad technology.  It
has uses.  However, it should be a business decision as to whether to use
AJAX, not a decision based on "coolness".

Joe