Re: Netserver no start when internet down -- MIDRANGE-L

Rob,

QDilgard is the netserver name, always has been. Too many years ago to
remember why I did it that way.

I probably didn't explain myself well enough in asking Charles that
question as the thread has morphed a bit.  I would never expect (or want)
an external DNS server to find my IBM i netserver.  I was more interested
in internal workstations and the IBM i being able to find internet sites if
the internal DNS servers were down.



On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 10:54 AM, <rob@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Jeff,
>
> Later on I said that an internet one might be ok for backup but I would
> have put it further down the list.
> But you're saying it finds DILGARD from one of the Windows based servers.
> Ok.
> So maybe, if you weren't doing the host table entry thing then perhaps
> Qdilgard needs to be added to the Windows DNS servers also?
> But part of me is skeptical that Qdilgard would have been in your internet
> based one.  I would have thought that only Dilgard would have been there.
> Does your internet based one support Qdilgard?
>
> OTOH, Is it really this "Q" issue?  Because we have no "Q" entry for our
> system name in our host table entry.  And the only entry in our DNS is for
> a long abandoned IP address.  (Apparently I have some cleanup of that to
> do.)
>
>
> Rob Berendt
> --
> IBM Certified System Administrator - IBM i 6.1
> Group Dekko
> Dept 1600
> Mail to:  2505 Dekko Drive
>           Garrett, IN 46738
> Ship to:  Dock 108
>           6928N 400E
>           Kendallville, IN 46755
> http://www.dekko.com
>
>
>
>
>
> From:   Jeff Crosby <jlcrosby@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To:     Midrange Systems Technical Discussion <midrange-l@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Date:   05/15/2015 10:39 AM
> Subject:        Re: Netserver no start when internet down
> Sent by:        "MIDRANGE-L" <midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
>
>
>
> Rob,
>
> No.  It finds it from the first internal Windows DNS server.  I don't
> understand what you're getting at.  What does this have to do with my
> question to Charles?  My point is that if you're a very small company
> (like
> Dilgard) you don't have the luxury of redundant everything internal. Since
> you can have many DNS servers configured, why not have at least one of
> them
> be external?
>
>
> On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 10:25 AM, <rob@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> > Jeff,
> >
> > If you run a NSLOOKUP the only place it can find the IP address of your
> > IBM i is "out there" and not in any of your windows based DNS servers?
> >
> > C:\Users\ROB>nslookup gdihq
> > Server:  gdsdns.dekko-1
> > Address:  10.10.4.250
> >
> > Name:    gdihq.dekko-1
> > Address:  10.17.6.33
> >
> > Says that it found gdihq on dns server gdsdns.
> >
> > From IBM i:
> >
> > NSLOOKUP HOSTNAME('gdihq.dekko-1')
> >
> > Server:         10.10.4.250
> > Address:        10.10.4.250#53
> > Name:   gdihq.dekko-1
> > Address: 10.17.6.33
> > Press ENTER to end terminal session.
> >
> > from
> > CFGTCP
> > 12. Change TCP/IP domain information
> > Domain name server:
> >   Internet address . . . . . . .   '10.10.4.250'
> >   Internet address . . . . . . .   '10.10.4.252'
> >   Internet address . . . . . . .   '10.17.4.180'
> >
> > Rob Berendt
> > --
> > IBM Certified System Administrator - IBM i 6.1
> > Group Dekko
> > Dept 1600
> > Mail to:  2505 Dekko Drive
> >           Garrett, IN 46738
> > Ship to:  Dock 108
> >           6928N 400E
> >           Kendallville, IN 46755
> > http://www.dekko.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > From:   Jeff Crosby <jlcrosby@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > To:     Midrange Systems Technical Discussion <midrange-l@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > Date:   05/15/2015 10:19 AM
> > Subject:        Re: Netserver no start when internet down
> > Sent by:        "MIDRANGE-L" <midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >
> >
> >
> > Charles,
> >
> > "Those DNS servers are the only ones that should be contacting internet
> > based
> > DNS servers."
> >
> > Why?  We're a small company.  We have 2 Windows servers, both virtual,
> > serving DNS.  Both on the one and only SAN we have.  Why not have an
> > additional DNS server "out there" in case the SAN has an issue?
> >
> > Just curious.
> >
> >
> > On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 9:00 AM, Charles Wilt <charles.wilt@xxxxxxxxx>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Once it's started, it doesn't matter so much.
> > >
> > > IMO, you should have at least primary and backup internal DNS servers.
> > > Those DNS servers are the only ones that should be contacting internet
> > > based DNS servers.
> > >
> > > Charles
> > >
> > >
> > > On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 8:47 AM, Jeff Crosby
> <jlcrosby@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > It all makes sense to me.  But I'm kind of amazed we never noticed
> it
> > > > during other internet outages.  We very seldom experience an outage
> > but
> > > > over a 10+ year period you'd think we would have noticed it before.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Fri, May 15, 2015 at 7:18 AM, Jim Oberholtzer <
> > > > midrangel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > I agree with putting the system name/IP entry in the local host
> > table,
> > > > > that's critical for several things not just the Netserver.  There
> is
> > a
> > > > > reasonable alternative.  IBM i has a DNS server built in to it.
> Most
> > > > folks
> > > > > chose not to use it but it's there.   You could simply configure
> > that
> > > as
> > > > a
> > > > > backup to the main DNS and now your back to only one place to
> change
> > > it.
> > > > > You would only put the addresses/domains that are internal to your
> > shop
> > > > in
> > > > > it but then as long as either the M$ DNS is running  --or-- your
> IBM
> > i
> > > > > server is running you'll get DNS resolution.
> > > > >
> > > > > Now some will immediately spring up and claim that auditors will
> > never
> > > > > accept an IBM i running DNS for whatever reasons Microsoft has
> > managed
> > > to
> > > > > convince them about using anything but AD as your DNS server, but
> > > that's
> > > > > really all FUD.  If you keep up with the security PTFs and the
> other
> > > > > updates
> > > > > IBM puts out, there is really no issue with it.
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Jim Oberholtzer
> > > > > Chief Technical Architect
> > > > > Agile Technology Architects
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: MIDRANGE-L [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On
> Behalf
> > Of
> > > > > Scott
> > > > > Klement
> > > > > Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2015 11:23 PM
> > > > > To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion
> > > > > Subject: Re: Netserver no start when internet down
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Jeff,
> > > > >
> > > > > NetServer needs to know it's host and IP address.  The problem
> with
> > IP
> > > > > address is that the system can have many of them, so how does it
> > know
> > > > which
> > > > > one is the "main" IP address?
> > > > >
> > > > > So what it does is take your hostname (QDILGARD in your case) and
> > try
> > > to
> > > > > perform a DNS lookup to get the IP address.  It will then use that
> > as
> > > the
> > > > > main IP address for NetServer.
> > > > >
> > > > > Apparently your DNS was set up to contact Internet DNS servers --
> so
> > > the
> > > > > lookup would fail (or time out) before getting a result for
> > QDILGARD.
> > > > > Therefore it could not start the NetServer.
> > > > >
> > > > > Putting QDILGARD in the host table means that it'll always be able
> > to
> > > > find
> > > > > it's own IP address, even if the network is down.  So this is
> > > considered
> > > > a
> > > > > "best practice" to always have the IP address that's connected to
> > the
> > > > > system
> > > > > name be in the host table.  Granted, this does mean that there's
> one
> > > more
> > > > > place to change it if the IP address changes...  but as long as
> this
> > > (and
> > > > > the DNS server) are the only places, that shouldn't be too
> > > cumbersome.  A
> > > > > lot better than being down when the Internet is offline!
> > > > >
> > > > > -SK
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On 5/14/2015 1:47 PM, Jeff Crosby wrote:
> > > > > > I learned something this morning and thought I would pass it
> along
> > in
> > > > > > case it helps someone else.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The day started with the internet being down.  In doing backup
> > checks
> > > > > > I noticed the BRMS recovery reports had not been copied to a
> > Windows
> > > > > > file server within the domain.  Reason is because Netserver was
> > not
> > > > > started.
> > > > > > Tried to reset and start Netserver and got this in QSYSOPR (I
> > > stripped
> > > > > > out some portions):
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Message ID . . . . . . :   CPIB683
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Date sent  . . . . . . :   05/14/15      Time sent  . . . . . .
> :
> > > > > > 07:16:51
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Message . . . . :   IBM i Support for Windows Network
> Neighborhood
> > > > (IBM i
> > > > > >
> > > > > >    NetServer) was unable to start.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Cause . . . . . :   The required IBM i NetServer job QZLSSERVER
> > was
> > > > > unable
> > > > > > to
> > > > > >    start because of reason code 13.  See the following reason
> > codes
> > > > > > and their
> > > > > >    meanings:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >      13 - The retrieved host IP address of 6.0.0.7 is invalid.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Recovery  . . . :   Complete recovery for the specified reason
> > code.
> > > > > >    13 - Correct the name configured for IBM i NetServer which
> > > > > > conflicts with an existing name on the network, and try the
> > request
> > > > > again.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The Netserver name has not changed since day one so I opened a
> PMR
> > > (by
> > > > > > phone since no internet either!).  No idea what the 6.0.0.7 IP
> > > address
> > > > is
> > > > > .
> > > > > > . .
> > > > > >
> > > > > > After the internet came back up just for fun I tried starting
> > > > > > Netserver again and it worked.  Huh?  What does the internet
> have
> > to
> > > do
> > > > > with it?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Rochester called in response to the PMR and she said she could
> fix
> > > > that.
> > > > > > In CHGTCPDMN we have 3 DNS servers listed, 1 internal Windows
> and
> > 2
> > > > > > Comcast.  The 2 external have something to do with it.  So she
> had
> > me
> > > > > > add the Netserver name "QDILGARD" to the host table entries on
> the
> > > IBM
> > > > > > i so it would find the IP address for the i there.  With or
> > without
> > > > > > internet.  She was aware of this behavior but could not answer
> > why.
> > > > > > She was curious herself, said she would ask the developer when
> he
> > > > > > arrived, and report back to me via the PMR.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I waited until now hoping the PMR would have something of an
> > > > > > explanation, but it still does not.  If I get something I will
> > pass
> > > it
> > > > > along.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
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> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Jeff Crosby
> > > > VP Information Systems
> > > > UniPro FoodService/Dilgard
> > > > P.O. Box 13369
> > > > Ft. Wayne, IN 46868-3369
> > > > 260-422-7531
> > > > www.dilgardfoods.com
> > > >
> > > > The opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily the opinion of
> > my
> > > > company.  Unless I say so.
> > > > --
> > > > This is the Midrange Systems Technical Discussion (MIDRANGE-L)
> mailing
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> > > >
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> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Jeff Crosby
> > VP Information Systems
> > UniPro FoodService/Dilgard
> > P.O. Box 13369
> > Ft. Wayne, IN 46868-3369
> > 260-422-7531
> > www.dilgardfoods.com
> >
> > The opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily the opinion of my
> > company.  Unless I say so.
> > --
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>
>
> --
> Jeff Crosby
> VP Information Systems
> UniPro FoodService/Dilgard
> P.O. Box 13369
> Ft. Wayne, IN 46868-3369
> 260-422-7531
> www.dilgardfoods.com
>
> The opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily the opinion of my
> company.  Unless I say so.
> --
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