RE: The future of computing -- MIDRANGE-L

Chris,

The best solution can rarely be determined by technical merit alone.

However, the discussion is beginning to degenerate into another pointless OS
war, and I consider that my queue to exit.


-john



> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-midrange-l@midrange.com
> [mailto:owner-midrange-l@midrange.com]On Behalf Of Chris Rehm
> Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2001 9:29 PM
> To: MIDRANGE-L@midrange.com
> Subject: Re: The future of computing
>
>
> > > In total honesty, I have felt that the people who deployed NT
> > > server for the
> > > majority of applications in critical locations within enterprises over
> the
> > > last 9 years are simply willing to rip off their employer for a
> paycheck.
> >
> > Really? I guess that makes me unethical, selfish, and a disgrace to my
> > profession.
>
> I am surprised and sorry to learn that.
>
> > > Now, some of those people I am sure convinced themselves that
> they were
> > > installing the best choice of application server. Some of the
> > > cases, it was
> > > the best choice. But in the majority of cases it was not the best
> > > choice and
> > > the person installing it either did or should have known that
> to be the
> > > case.
> >
> > And since I'm well acquainted with the AS/400, that makes my decisions
> > irresponsible at best. Perhaps I can chalk it off to my obvious
> delusions.
>
> Don't discout self-delusion so easily. With money involved, people often
> find it easy to convince themselves that what they are doing is
> the "right"
> thing.
>
> > > The reason I feel so strongly about that is it shames me to think that
> my
> > > profession is not only populated with the kind of whores who will
> install
> > > whatever makes them money whether or not it is the best choice,
> > > but that is
> > > exactly the sort of mentality that makes up the lion's share of this
> > > profession.
> >
> > And I presume that an IBM BP selling a low-end 270 with an
> > FSIO-Whatever-it's-called-now as a file/print server would not be
> considered
> > such a whore?
>
> Says who? My gosh, for years there were IBM whores all over Las Vegas. I'm
> talking about guys who worked for IBM and those who were BPs. But in most
> shops there were managers, and/or programmers who would actually evaluate
> the solutions being offered.
>
> I remember going into a golf/tennis distributor in Las Vegas and
> setting up
> their System/36. Installing software, etc. I had been told they were
> upgrading but they'd taken delivery of a smaller system so they were
> awaiting additional memory/disk. One of the employees was
> complaining about
> performance and I pointed out it would be better when the upgrade arrived.
> That was when I found out they hadn't been told that was the deal. The IBM
> sales rep and the BP who contracted me had both decided to commit this
> customer to this path and then force him into the upgrade to get
> it to fly.
> Whores. Fraudulent whores.
>
> Those guys aren't gone. Right now that very same business partner and that
> very same IBM employee, who is now a business partner, make money
> hand over
> fist marketing NT networks. Now, they will sell anything, AS/400s, Novell,
> Unix variants, but they tend to focus on Microsoft products
> because they are
> the most lucrative.
>
> > > I feel that there was a time when people would actually research
> > > technology
> > > for a chosen application and would come back to management with what
> they
> > > felt was the best solution. I feel that it is much more common to just
> > > suggest the solution "I" know most about now. If an AS/400
> professional
> > > isn't willing to determine whether or not the AS/400 is the
> best choice
> to
> > > deploy the new web app, and the NT professional isn't willing to
> determine
> > > whether or not NT is the best backbone for the data warehouse, and on
> down
> > > the line, then they are pretty low.
> >
> > Now I'm confused. Did you just acknowledge that the AS/400 might not be
> the
> > best choice for everything that involves a computer?
>
> Duh.
>
> > > C'mon John, apples and oranges. If the only computers ever
> made were the
> > > ones being made in 1943, you think there'd be one in every house?
> >
> > > By the way, you should be careful before taking a shot like that
> > > about heads
> > > of corporations, It could lead to some flood of quotes from
> > > current heads of
> > > corporations.
> >
> >
> > And those that chose to do so would only be displaying that they've
> > completely missed the point. It was not a shot at Mr. Watson, or at Jim.
> It
> > was an example of the dangers inherent in adopting an isolationist
> attitude.
>
> Isolationist attitude? Is that what it is when you prefer using the best
> tool for the job?
>
> It's not like you can take the NT of today and try to justify all
> the things
> installed with it over the last (almost) decade with the current product.
> How many years has this been such a joke? MIS shops with AS/400s
> running for
> years with no unscheduled downtime replacing CPUs with platforms that
> require constant care and still crash mercilessly.
>
> I would say, "The AS/400 is lousy for xxx." or "NT would be good for xxx"
> but each judgment should be made in the perspective of the
> overall needs of
> that shop. You can't say the AS/400 isn't the best choice for Notes, but I
> know of cases where it sure wasn't. But I know that there will be cases
> where it is the best choice.
>
> The bottom line, John, is that the state of the marketplace says something
> about the consumers there. You and I should look for the best
> solutions, no
> matter the source. Even if they for some reason come from the horrible
> Oracle demons.
>
> > -john
>

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