Re: VAJAVA vs CODE/400 -- JAVA400-L

The last time I tried to install VAJ was version 3.0.2.  The installation
twice halted the system (NT Server 4.0, SP6a), which is very rare under NT
(couldn't kill the running processes).  A previous install of a version 3.0
did actually get itself off the ground, but even with the latest service
packs installed it was not usable (it regularly stopped responding, and I
lost the source code I was testing with).  Unfortunately, these issues are
not related to usability, such as a NoClassDefFound, which would have been
resolvable.  My installation machines have all been at least PIII 733 mHz
machines with at least 256mb memory loaded with NT 4.0 at the latest service
pack level.

My preference would be to stick with IBM, and I would prefer also to use an
IDE, but I'm hesitant to spend more money to upgrade to a later version of
VAJ which I have no confidence can even install successfully, and this is
one specific area which needs work.  Based on my experiences, I am surprised
to hear that anyone is successfully using VAJ, so maybe I will consider
upgrading to 3.5, and the Linux availability for VAJ provides an additional
compelling reason to try it again.

One usability concern I've had with VAJ, and one which is echoed in the
article "Linux-Friendly VisualAge for Java" linked directly from IBM's VAJ
Info page
(http://www-4.ibm.com/software/ad/vajava/about/v35/vaj35platforms.html), is
that source code is not stored in the file system, but rather within VAJ's
repository, so data corruption (or even intended behaviour of the product)
can alter/damage/destroy your source code.  Here's an excerpt:

***
But woe to you if you need to incorporate an outside technology into your
development process. The only way to expose your project to the outside
world is by exporting either source code or bytecode. If you can't already
see the train wreck ahead, let me provide a simple example which immediately
confronted me.

The project I am currently working on is stored in a remote CVS repository.
If I want to use VisualAge on my project, I have to import the entire thing
into the VisualAge repository. When I'm finished making my changes, I need
to export the entire project (or, if I've kept track of which classes I've
modified, I can just export those) back to the file system. When the code is
exported, all the original formatting, warts and all, is reworked to conform
to the VisualAge formatting specifications. Unfortunately, this tends to
confuse diff to no end, rendering the merge- and change-history capabilities
of CVS/RCS completely useless. My response to IBM vis-�-vis the wisdom of
the repository approach would be an invocation of the Hippocratic oath:
First do no harm. If a feature is not useful, you should be able to ignore
it. It should never stand in the way of using the entire product.
***

Has anyone had any problems with this model?

Thanks,
Shawn


----- Original Message -----
From: "Joe Pluta" <joepluta@PlutaBrothers.com>
To: <JAVA400-L@midrange.com>
Sent: Monday, June 18, 2001 1:26 PM
Subject: RE: VAJAVA vs CODE/400


> VAJ 3.5 Patch 2 is very reliable and robust.  For me, it's far easier,
> especially at jar file packaging and deployment, than command line
> techniques.  Each person has their own style, but I haven't had a single
> problem with VAJ as an editor in quite some time.  Anybody who has a
> specific problem with VAJ, please post it and let's see what we can do to
> address it.
>
> Joe Pluta
> Moderator
>
> P.S. Please do not turn this into an IBM vs. Microsoft discussion, or even
a
> "my IDE is better than your IDE" argument.  If there is a specific area
> where one IDE is better than another, feel free to post details.  By far,
> though, the best discussions are "how-to": if you have a problem, please
> post it and we'll see if we can answer it.
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-java400-l@midrange.com
> > [mailto:owner-java400-l@midrange.com]On Behalf Of Shawn Church
> > Sent: Monday, June 18, 2001 10:28 AM
> > To: JAVA400-L@midrange.com
> > Subject: Re: VAJAVA vs CODE/400
> >
> >
> > I gave up on VAJava a long time ago; it really isn't very good despite
all
> > the hype.  I have installed various versions of VAJava 4 or 5
> > times over the
> > past 3 years, along with any available fix packs, but I rarely have
gotten
> > it to work reliably, and I am not comfortable it will not dump all my
work
> > when it crashes.  JBuilder is better (not as fancy, but more
> > reliable), but
> > I am much more productive with a good text editor such as UltraEdit.
> >
> > The Java language however should not be blamed for shortcomings in IDEs.
> > Java will be around for a long time to come, and it is a very powerful,
> > easily-learned language (OO concepts are probably more difficult for
many
> > people to get a handle on than the language itself).
> >
> > I have gone back to using a decent editor and compiling and deploying
from
> > the command line, at least until a better IDE comes along.
> >
> > As far as VB is concerned, most Microsoft products are excellent, and
many
> > of the slams are misdirected at applications rather than the Windows
> > operating system itself, which more arguably deserves criticism.  Visual
> > Studio is certainly more advanced than any of the Java IDEs I have used.
> >
> > Shawn
>
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