Steve, I've had to put up with the 10 years experience (1 year 10 times) but since she was hired out of college it was more of 12 months (2 weeks 24 times). This was on the early System 36 and we had to literally explain the RPG cycle every month. It turns out that her visa had expired before she was hired. The manager that hired her would not fire her. It took a change of manager and two weeks to get her walking papers signed. More recently I have seen the HR mess. A company I was consulting for wanted to hire a programmer and as the only technical person I took care of that part of the interviews. After the first one, which I had tagged as an impostor after five minutes on the phone, the HR director wanted me to detail why I rejected them. I made the mistake of telling her how I had asked the applicant if they always designed databases to fifth normal form. BTW this applicant responded with one word "Yes". I later found out that in the first conversation she had with each subsequent applicant SHE asked this question. I had tried to explain the basis of normalized database design to her but, she was the type that thought you could run a full HR department for a 300 employee EEO plant on one excel spreadsheet. This female was another example of your lawyer. She was sticking her fingers (not just her nose, which I don't mind as much) in to so much of the rest of the company, while her department kept falling behind, that they called her HB (H*ll B**ch) or PHB (Dilbert...) and most local vendors wouldn't deal with the company anymore. I don't go around saying someone has to use a computer in a certain way because I am certified. Nor do I place it more than on basic materials that may be placed before people that don't know me. It provides a lot of openings for me to explain what I have done to gain and keep a certificate. And that is the first part of marketing, getting an opening to provide the second part which is to differentiate yourself from others. Roger Vicker, CCP Steve Landess wrote: > I don't know why, but this kind of reminds me of the day I was in Alamo > Rent-a-Car at DFW airport and this guy next to me was giving the clerk at > the counter a really hard time - cursing and screaming because he had to > wait in line for FIVE minutes. When I asked him "Can you just be nice?" he > told me to f*ck off, and when I called him an *sshole he said "You better > watch what you say to me, I'm a lawyer!". So I said, "SUE ME!". If I had > laid one finger on him he would have sued me...my, what a pretentious fellow > he was... > > also have a low tolerance for those people who have 1 year of experience 10 > times... I have had to clean up behind this type of bozo at least half a > dozen times in the last 20 years. Often the problem is because the HR > department gets involved in the hiring process and weeds out the > best-qualified technical people for the wrong reasons. > > When I was working at Blockbuster Video in 1989-1990 in Dallas I was billing > $ 50.00 per hour. Andersen Consulting was billing $ 75.00-$100.00 per hour > for just-hired college graduates and had ME teaching them JDE and the > AS/400. > -- *** Vicker Programming and Service *** Have bits will byte *** www.vicker.com *** Hey Santa, how much for your list of naughty girls?