Re: Advanced Job Scheduler -- MIDRANGE-L

It's not a matter of where IBM wants to invest it's dollars, it a matter of IBM's sales strategy is to sell it's products primarily through business partners. Those BPs are IBM's feet on the street, customer facing sales force. IBM needs those BPs to be successful in order to keep selling more IBM HW/SW. If IBM invested a little money in an online marketplace, they would end up competing with the BPs, who would in turn then have less incentive to sell IBM products and IBM would loose in the long run.

Customers can buy directly from IBM but in most cases would be paying a much higher price for products than if they went through a BP.

-----Original Message----- From: Aaron Bartell
Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2016 12:17 PM
To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion
Subject: Re: Advanced Job Scheduler

how do you want IBM to invest its money?

Well, the other way to ask that question... if IBM were to go direct to
customers and make it easy, how much more income would they get? I don't
know and don't care to speculate.

I will however speculate on the change in personality of IT people.
They/we are expecting a much smoother delivery and when they/we see IBM's
processes, well, it paints a very bad picture of the modern-ness IBM i.
IBM has automated so much with things like Bluemix. Of course it's easier
to do things different with a new effort like Bluemix. I am sure it won't
be easy, but I do believe it is a necessity for survival.

Aaron Bartell
litmis.com - Services for open source on IBM i

On Wed, Mar 30, 2016 at 11:01 AM, Jim Oberholtzer <
midrangel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Mike,

I agree that it could, and maybe should be done as you describe below.

Now ask a simpler question: how do you want IBM to invest its money? Do
you
want them building the web presence you cite below, or do you want them
enhancing IBM i and its licensed programs? Would you prefer an easier
purchase, albeit more expensive since the cost of the site must be
recovered, or a lower price point where you use a business partner.

It's not that I'm against anything suggested in this thread; however IBM
unlike the US Federal Government cannot print money. How would you prefer
they spend it? What is the return on the web presence you would like? I'm
guessing folks at IBM have done the math and it does not work out in favor
of spending the money needed to build that system vs. the extra sales it
would generate.

If you folks want that type of ordering, then a business case must be made
to do it.

You have the ability to influence the decision. COMMON has a function call
the COMMON Americas Advisory Board(CAAC). Petition them to get IBM to
build
this site, or better yet volunteer to be a member of that group. The Large
Users Group has massive influence on IBMs spending. They should step up
and
demand this function. Neither body has demanded it. Now why would IBM
invest millions without its customer base demanding this type of site?

--
Jim Oberholtzer
Agile Technology Architects

-----Original Message-----
From: MIDRANGE-L [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
Mike
Cunningham
Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2016 10:31 AM
To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion
Subject: RE: Advanced Job Scheduler

IBM is a giant in the IT industry. They have the capabilities of Watson to
use as much as they want. Why can't they build an online ordering system
that knows and understands the relationship between their hardware and
their
software and my needs and tell me what product I should be ordering that is
right for me? A Watson powered IBM Business Partner. I do still like to
talk
to my BP on a regular basis and have them come see me to keep in touch with
my needs and business and make recommendations I may not have thought of,
but if I know I want BRMS added to my existing system I should be able to
order it myself and download and install it immediately.

Mike Cunningham
VP of Information Technology Services/CIO Pennsylvania College of
Technology

-----Original Message-----
From: MIDRANGE-L [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
Aaron
Bartell
Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2016 9:42 AM
To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion <midrange-l@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: Advanced Job Scheduler

Jim,

Thanks for the response. It's time we get creative and move on from our
old
ways of thinking. If I were to summarize your statements: It's monetarily
risky to purchase software from IBM.

What if we could remove that risk because it was dead simple to obtain
software trials and payment was metered?

Aaron Bartell
litmis.com - Services for open source on IBM i

On Wed, Mar 30, 2016 at 8:17 AM, Jim Oberholtzer <
midrangel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> Aaron,
>
> At the risk of hacking a few people off I must strongly disagree.
> First off I am NOT a business partner with IBM. I do work with one
> when the need arises. I am however IBM certified in design and
> implementation of Power8:
>
> IBM Certified Technical Sales Specialist - Power Systems with POWER8
> Enterprise V1 IBM Certified Technical Sales Specialist - Power Systems
> with POWER8 Scale-out V1 IBM Certified System Administrator - IBM i V1
> Too many others to list here....
>
> 98% of the customers would order the wrong thing, pay too much for it,
> and not get what they want. Configuring a Power8 box while much
> easier than it was with Power5 still has many options and depending on
> the circumstance one option might not fit the customer's need vs.
> another. It takes an experienced and knowledgeable individual to get
> that done. That's why IBM requires all business partners to get
> certified, and reviews the orders carefully. In the end it saves
> money to do it right once, rather than back into the correct solution.
>
> These comments apply to software as well. AJS is an example that is
> simple, there are no dependencies but BRMS was discussed in this
> thread as well.
> There are dependencies there (Media and storage Extensions for one)
> and if there is encryption included then the options start to get
complicated.
> Only a certified business partner is going to know how to make the
> order once, correctly, and satisfy the customers need.
>
> What about other software products on the system that have conflicting
> dependencies (WAS and Domino come to mind almost immediately) do the
> customers really understand all of those things?
>
> I would agree that in the case of AJS it should be simple, but then
> again maybe not.
>
> --
> Jim Oberholtzer
> Agile Technology Architects
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: MIDRANGE-L [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
> Aaron Bartell
> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2016 8:02 AM
> To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion
> Subject: Re: Advanced Job Scheduler
>
> >Call your Business Partner.
>
> I almost bit my tongue, but decided against it.
>
> Am I wrong to be fed up with the need to contact a business partner to
> gain access to products I already know I want to buy? IBM (Steve
> Will) is agreeing that automation** is an ingredient of success. I
> see the formal IBM Business Partners as an unnecessary hurdle to get
> over. Imagine a world where I could click and pay on a web page to
> get new products installed on IBM i in 2 minutes. What am I missing?
>
> **http://bit.ly/youandi-strategy2015
>
> Aaron Bartell
> litmis.com - Services for open source on IBM i
>
>
> On Wed, Mar 30, 2016 at 7:04 AM, Rob Berendt <rob@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> > What it all boils down to is:
> > Call your Business Partner.
> >
> > While it would be nice to simply find a list price on the internet
> > and be done with it many software products simply do not work that > > way.
> >
> > IDK why. I have my suspicions:
> > 1 - To avoid sticker shock we want you to listen to our siren's.
> > You can't resist their voices.
> > 2 - No one pays list. That's just there to gouge you on maintenance
> > at x% of current list price.
> > 3 - As long as you're looking at... you should really look at ... > > also.
> > 4 - Honest attempt to make sure you're buying the right thing. Or
> > don't buy 5770-xyz when you may be entitled to a free upgrade from
> 5761-xyz.
> >
> > Now, if you're trying to convince your boss and he's the only one
> > who is allowed to contact your business partner, then I can
> > understand your reluctance.
> >
> > Some of the BP's on this list are getting tired of answering such
> > questions. Irks them when they do all the research and then you
> > contact your national BP who only says tell me what they told you
> > and undercuts the price.
> >
> > Rob Berendt
> > --
> > IBM Certified System Administrator - IBM i 6.1 Group Dekko Dept 1600
> > Mail to: 2505 Dekko Drive
> > Garrett, IN 46738
> > Ship to: Dock 108
> > 6928N 400E
> > Kendallville, IN 46755
> > http://www.dekko.com
> >
> --
> This is the Midrange Systems Technical Discussion (MIDRANGE-L) mailing
> list To post a message email: MIDRANGE-L@xxxxxxxxxxxx To subscribe,
> unsubscribe, or change list options,
> visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/midrange-l
> or email: MIDRANGE-L-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx Before posting, please take
> a moment to review the archives at
http://archive.midrange.com/midrange-l.
>
> Please contact support@xxxxxxxxxxxx for any subscription related
> questions.
>
> --
> This is the Midrange Systems Technical Discussion (MIDRANGE-L) mailing
> list To post a message email: MIDRANGE-L@xxxxxxxxxxxx To subscribe,
> unsubscribe, or change list options,
> visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/midrange-l
> or email: MIDRANGE-L-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx Before posting, please take
> a moment to review the archives at
> http://archive.midrange.com/midrange-l.
>
> Please contact support@xxxxxxxxxxxx for any subscription related
> questions.
>
--
This is the Midrange Systems Technical Discussion (MIDRANGE-L) mailing list
To post a message email: MIDRANGE-L@xxxxxxxxxxxx To subscribe,
unsubscribe,
or change list options,
visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/midrange-l
or email: MIDRANGE-L-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx Before posting, please take a
moment to review the archives at http://archive.midrange.com/midrange-l.

Please contact support@xxxxxxxxxxxx for any subscription related
questions.
--
This is the Midrange Systems Technical Discussion (MIDRANGE-L) mailing list
To post a message email: MIDRANGE-L@xxxxxxxxxxxx To subscribe,
unsubscribe,
or change list options,
visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/midrange-l
or email: MIDRANGE-L-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx Before posting, please take a
moment to review the archives at http://archive.midrange.com/midrange-l.

Please contact support@xxxxxxxxxxxx for any subscription related
questions.

--
This is the Midrange Systems Technical Discussion (MIDRANGE-L) mailing list
To post a message email: MIDRANGE-L@xxxxxxxxxxxx
To subscribe, unsubscribe, or change list options,
visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/midrange-l
or email: MIDRANGE-L-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Before posting, please take a moment to review the archives
at http://archive.midrange.com/midrange-l.

Please contact support@xxxxxxxxxxxx for any subscription related
questions.