Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Express, React, Node.JS -- WEB400

We looked at React before moving to Angular 2 at the time (which was a significant change from v1) but we decided against it because Angular seemed to be more a more complete framework (for example React did not have a routing element back then and, as far as I know it doesn't now, so you have to rely on third party routers) and I also didn't like the syntax of React, it always looked odd to me embedding stray chunks of HTML into Javascript, but I also might have been a bit biased due to having a bit of experience with Angular 1. Angular is also more opinionated than React, meaning you are steered more to doing things the "Angular way", which we saw as a good thing. Because of the sheer amount of new stuff we'd have to be learning already we didn't want to be distracted by having to examine which one of several possible ways of doing something would be best when we didn't really have the experience or time to do so, nor did we want to have to depend on too many other libraries (like a third party router for example). Another benefit we saw was Angular's use of Typescript, which makes Javascript much less evil!

If you come from a pure RPG environment then there's no getting away from the fact you are in for a massive wake up call whichever web technology you go for. We have had to get to grips with Javascript, Typescript, Angular, CSS, Bootstrap, HTML5, Git, to name but a few. As well as RESTful concepts and how to rethink our traditional way of coding in a stateless world (e.g. concurrency). The learning curve is very steep and often things are much less stable compared to what we're used to. IBM go to great lengths (and do a very good job) not to break existing code when things change, but in the web world things are much more fragile and fast moving and just when you think you've got to grips with something, it's replaced with the next big thing. For example, callbacks as discussed elsewhere in this thread were superseded by promises, which have become the Javascript "await" syntax, and have a learning curve all of their own, these have now been superseded by observables which come from a paradigm called "Reactive Programming" - again more learning curve!

We've been using Angular since version 1, it's now on version 5 and it's changed hugely between the two versions and it has at times been very frustrating trying to keep up with the pace of change (doesn't help when you're the age of an average RPG programmer!) but I would say Angular has reached a good level of maturity now and there are various tools (such at the Angular CLI) which make scaffolding a a new application, complete with all the necessary build chain, a cinch. I honestly don't know how much of a learning curve Angular would have compared to React or Vue as I haven't tried to learn them but we are very happy with Angular.

________________________________
From: WEB400 <web400-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx> on behalf of Kelly Cookson <KCookson@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: 26 February 2018 15:27
To: Web Enabling the IBM i (AS/400 and iSeries)
Subject: Re: [WEB400] [EXTERNAL] Re: Express, React, Node.JS

Thanks for sharing that, Tim. There are a lot of good ways to bring the IBM i to the web.

What was your shop's learning curve with Angular? I've heard Angular has a relatively steep learning curve, but I usually hear that from people advocating for other technologies. So I'd like to know your take on the learning curve for Angular.

The reasons why I'm looking at Node, Express and React are because: (a) we have another development team interested in Node on the IBM i for their own reasons, (b) a lot of people use Express with Node, and (c) React is being used in one form or another by some high volume sites. For example, Walmart is using Node with something called Electrode, which is based on React. And React was created by Facebook.

But other technologies can be equally good at meeting the needs of various shops.

Thanks,

Kelly Cookson
IT Project Leader
Dot Foods, Inc.
217-773-4486 ext. 12676
https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=www.dotfoods.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cc14beca9f0ff4c12189f08d57d251319%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636552520535654977&sdata=4lIAgzgcgKmVY0S34vlc7ToCNBviZcuMqggkRJ8exrQ%3D&reserved=0<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dotfoods.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cc14beca9f0ff4c12189f08d57d251319%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636552520535654977&sdata=u%2BTXROat9bKVhykvKbLi9fq3LUvzctn%2FELwgGdH4qcg%3D&reserved=0>

From: WEB400 [mailto:web400-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Tim Fathers
Sent: Monday, February 26, 2018 3:48 AM
To: Web Enabling the IBM i (AS/400 and iSeries)
Subject: Re: [WEB400] [EXTERNAL] Re: Express, React, Node.JS

...our solution is to have a thin Java layer running under Tomcat on the IBM i which exposes SQL stored procedures in a sort of RESTful way, so that you can execute them by POSTing to a URL like this:
http://myibmi-d:8080/webspi/sp/default/SP_QryMthInvSts<http://ger400-d:8080/webspi/sp/default/W222_SP_QryMthInvSts<http://myibmi-d:8080/webspi/sp/default/SP_QryMthInvSts%3chttp:/ger400-d:8080/webspi/sp/default/W222_SP_QryMthInvSts>> where (SP_QryMthInvSts is the stored procedure) with a JSON payload as the parameters: {"inputParms":{"YYYYMM_":201802,"STATUSFILTERS_":"!,W,U,N,D","PAGE_NUM_":1,"PAGE_SIZE_":20}}. The results sets are returned as a JSON object which always has the same structure regardless of which procedure was called. All of the business logic is written using SQL or RPG exposed as stored procedures which means people don't have to learn a new language or rewrite swathes of existing code in something new.

For the front-end we use Angular to create single-page web applications, which simply execute the stored procedures on the back-end and process the returned result sets to do their work.

Tim.

________________________________
From: WEB400 <web400-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:web400-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx>> on behalf of Kelly Cookson <KCookson@xxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:KCookson@xxxxxxxxxxxx>>
Sent: 23 February 2018 23:35
To: Web Enabling the IBM i (AS/400 and iSeries)
Subject: Re: [WEB400] [EXTERNAL] Re: Express, React, Node.JS

We had other development teams learn Angular for a mobile app. But they are not using Node.

We have been using .NET to develop web pages instead of green screens. However, Node has caught the attention of some developers. I'm diving in to figure out how to develop browser based interfaces and RESTful web services using Node. It seems like Express and React keep coming up. I know Node and its modules are supposed to be cross-platform. But I didn't know if there was anything unique due to the platform being PASE instead of Linux. (.NET Core runs on Linux but not in PASE, so the port to PASE can sometimes matter.)

Thanks,

Kelly Cookson
IT Project Leader
Dot Foods, Inc.
217-773-4486 ext. 12676
https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=www.dotfoods.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cdaada53524114ac3709108d57b0dbdc7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636550221301337750&sdata=UbM%2FuUo7jLxPtawL0nhTfZ5JsMHjh3sR%2BOt3wmprb9I%3D&reserved=0<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=www.dotfoods.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cdaada53524114ac3709108d57b0dbdc7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636550221301337750&sdata=UbM%2FuUo7jLxPtawL0nhTfZ5JsMHjh3sR%2BOt3wmprb9I%3D&reserved=0><https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dotfoods.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cdaada53524114ac3709108d57b0dbdc7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636550221301337750&sdata=TSGxx87gW%2FiSTEsfKLghqPYuCzpALmNNJ3X6QACpnLQ%3D&reserved=0<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dotfoods.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cdaada53524114ac3709108d57b0dbdc7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636550221301337750&sdata=TSGxx87gW%2FiSTEsfK
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From: WEB400 [mailto:web400-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Kevin
Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 2:48 PM
To: Web Enabling the IBM i (AS/400 and iSeries)
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [WEB400] Express, React, Node.JS

There is not going to be anything specific to the IBMi out there for things like Express and React. There wouldn't be for any specific platform. The whole idea is that these things are platform agnostic and so just learning them is good enough for any platform. Only when you start accessing data does platform come in to play - and neither of those libraries help you there. I thought you were learning Angular anyway?

On 23 Feb 2018, at 17:37, Kelly Cookson <KCookson@xxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:KCookson@xxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:KCookson@xxxxxxxxxxxx%3cmailto:KCookson@xxxxxxxxxxxx>>> wrote:

I am currently learning JavaScript. My aim is to learn how to develop web apps and RESTful web services using Node on the IBM i. From what I have been reading, it sounds like Express module and the React library will be useful for me to learn.

It's easy to find documentation, tutorials and other learning materials for Express and React in general. What documentation, tutorials or learning materials do people recommend for Express and React specifically on the IBM i?

Thanks,

Kelly Cookson
IT Project Leader
Dot Foods, Inc.
217-773-4486 ext. 12676
https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=www.dotfoods.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cdaada53524114ac3709108d57b0dbdc7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636550221301337750&sdata=UbM%2FuUo7jLxPtawL0nhTfZ5JsMHjh3sR%2BOt3wmprb9I%3D&reserved=0<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=www.dotfoods.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cdaada53524114ac3709108d57b0dbdc7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636550221301337750&sdata=UbM%2FuUo7jLxPtawL0nhTfZ5JsMHjh3sR%2BOt3wmprb9I%3D&reserved=0><https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dotfoods.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cdaada53524114ac3709108d57b0dbdc7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636550221301337750&sdata=TSGxx87gW%2FiSTEsfKLghqPYuCzpALmNNJ3X6QACpnLQ%3D&reserved=0<https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dotfoods.com&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cdaada53524114ac3709108d57b0dbdc7%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C636550221301337750&sdata=TSGxx87gW%2FiSTEs

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.
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