Re: DB Maintenance Design Patterns -- WEB400

I agree with that premise to a certain extent - but my company is in the business of selling applications, and without "richness" our customers are not interested. For us, that is a bad thing for obvious reasons. By the same token, they want "fast" also. You can do both though, without having to eliminate JavaScript etc - although html5 may help become less dependent on it.

On 28 Jan 2013, at 22:26, "Dean, Robert" <rdean@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

Don't sell simple short. Simple is fast, and accessible.

Rich is good, too, but some sites implement richness for the sake of buzzword bingo. It should only be used when it improves the UX, and even then it should be used smartly. The site should not happily sacrifice download/render speed or accessibility for the sake of richness.
________________________________________
From: web400-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx [web400-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] on behalf of Richard Schoen [richard@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Monday, January 28, 2013 5:17 PM
To: web400@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [WEB400] DB Maintenance Design Patterns

I like it.

If you don't like Javascript, you are not entitled to the news. :-)

I guess we could all program our mobile sites with simple tables and columns and simple CSS.

So much for tools like jQuery, jQuery Mobile, Sencha, Phonegap etc to make our lives easier when writing mobile apps.......

Since UI sells apps, that may well be the kiss of death for any real application.

Regards,
Richard Schoen
RJS Software Systems Inc.
Where Information Meets Innovation
Document Management, Workflow, Report Delivery, Forms and Business Intelligence
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------------------------------

message: 5
date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 23:11:09 +0100
from: Henrik R?tzou <hr@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
subject: Re: [WEB400] DB Maintenance Design Patterns

Pete, try to access my homepage without javascript:

http://powerext.com

You will get nothing

Try to access cnn.com - you will get nothing

On Mon, Jan 28, 2013 at 11:08 PM, Pete Helgren <pete@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

"Why would anyone turn off JavaScript support these days"

Because javascript is one of the most popular attack vectors out there.
CSRF, XSS, drive bys, you name it. Javascript does plenty in the
background that we never see and that is why it is so popular with
hackers. I never enter a new or unknown site with Javascript enabled in
my browser and I take a look at what it is attempting to load before I
allow it to run. I use the noscript plugin and it has saved my rear end
multiple times....

Now *leaving* javascript disabled is another story, but entering a site,
yeah, turning off javascript makes for a funky experience but well
designed sites still deliver content without it and give you a heads up
about what the site won't provide when javascript is off.

Pete Helgren
www.petesworkshop.com
GIAC Secure Software Programmer-Java

On 1/28/2013 3:48 PM, Kevin Turner wrote:

Why would anyone turn off JavaScript support these days though - unless

they don't have any interest in using the Internet? Turning it off would
preclude you from using almost every modern website there is.

I guess the point is, why would Nathan need to demonstrate his example

working without JavaScript support? That would be almost as pointless as
demonstrating it without CSS support.

Lack of a mouse, on the other hand, is a valid point. You should be able

to navigate to any clickable element with the keyboard and hit enter to
trigger the event - but that requires JavaScript:)

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