Re: Using Eclipse and Subclipse

Thanks for that insight Mark.  We probably need to finish v0.0.1 of this 
project using Eclipse ISeries Projects and then review the issues we faced and 
make a strategic decision with regard to source/version control. Although the 
IFS will be used for this project for HTML and javascript etc, we don't intend 
to use the IFS for compiling/storing RPG/CL/DDS or copybook source. The message 
I am getting from you is that we will still be relying on our own "tools" on 
the iSeries to bridge any gaps we may face.    

-----Original Message-----
From: wdsci-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:wdsci-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On 
Behalf Of Mark Phippard
Sent: 07 February 2006 01:17
To: Websphere Development Studio Client for iSeries
Subject: Re: [WDSCI-L] Using Eclipse and Subclipse

> So, given you experience in this area, what would be the recommended
approach to developing
> large applications with Eclipse and Subclipse? Or is it a non-starter ?

I assume you mean large iSeries applications?  If that is the case, I think
you have to go with one of the known OS/400 CM tools.

> You said that we would get better results from an iSeries-specific
solution.  What did you have in
> mind?

I have basically spent my entire adult life working on and developing
TurnOver, so that is what I would recommend, but you would probably want to
look at all of them.  I do not know our current prices off the top of my
head, but unless you have a ton of developers and/or are working on a
really large system, the price is probably a lot less than you imagine.
Any of these tools ought to pay for themselves in other ways many times
over.

I really like Subversion, we use it to manage Java/HTML-type source code.
I think it could do a very good job managing RPG from a pure source-code
control point of view.  But the rest of the toolchain you need to do
software development on the iSeries is all geared around source files and
source members.  So you either need to use iSeries Projects as a way to
bridge the gap between the two worlds, or you use the compiler's support
for compiling from the IFS and then build a lot of supporting tools/scripts
yourself to make it all work with your process.  I do not think either of
these are good options on a small-scale, let alone a large scale.

There are some other smaller problems if you go down this path:

First, if you use iSeries Projects, it wants to have those first 12-bytes
from the source member on each line of your code.  This sucks from a source
control point of view because if something resequences a member or updates
the dates you are going to lose all of the diff/merge capability that makes
the tools nice in the first place.  It also keeps you from using any
editors other than LPEX.  I know people that are doing C development on
OS/400 are really bitten by this, since there are a lot of C editors they
could be using.

Second, if I were going to use Subversion to manage RPG, I would at least
want to be able to use folders to organize and structure the code as I
would in a large project in any other language.  iSeries Projects pretty
much will not allow this, and if you go the IFS route it likely complicates
the tools you will have to create to do your builds.

A few more ...

When compiling from IFS, you lose what I think is a nice feature, and that
is having the source information stored in the compiled object.  A lot of
people use this for auditing purposes, and you just plain lose it.

In RPG you have to make a decision about copybooks.  Are they going to be
in the IFS or source files.  Probably the IFS.  If so, again, it is going
to complicate the tools you write if you want to be able to do a compile
where some of the copybooks are in a development folder, and others are in
a production folder.

Good luck.

Mark






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