× The internal search function is temporarily non-functional. The current search engine is no longer viable and we are researching alternatives.
As a stop gap measure, we are using Google's custom search engine service.
If you know of an easy to use, open source, search engine ... please contact support@midrange.com.


  1.  Home
  2. MIDRANGE-L
  3. January 2014

Re: HMC network install of i5OS V7R1 from DSLO image, can't fine load source B2003110

I have seen MANY errors with the install of DE1 but usually it's option 2. Frequently the joblog says there is a profile that already exists and shouldn't. Delete it (and the one object it owns) and retry.

For Extended base there are only a zillion things that can cause that. I would certainly do that one all by itself rather than combined with DE1. Gives the job log on your interactive session that way also.

As to the OPTNET01 guy you are correct that it should work just fine with no IBM i level TCP/IP configured or started or Ethernet line description active.

The FIRST troubleshooting step in this case is from the Host partition ping the TCP/IP address of the service tools interface on this new partition. It MUST ping or you won't get far at all. If it does PING then the service tools interface is in good shape. If not then jump into SST and verify or reconfigure it. I have found that when the service tools interface is set from a network based install such as this it doesn't 'stick'. It seems to be in memory only so you need to put it back. Once you've done that it will stay through IPLs and shutdowns and restarts going forward.

I'm making the assumption here that the host partition is in the same state as previous with no restart of IP or NFS?


- Larry "DrFranken" Bolhuis

www.frankeni.com
www.iDevCloud.com
www.iInTheCloud.com

On 1/4/2014 9:44 PM, Steinmetz, Paul wrote:

V7R1 Client install complete, 2 LPP in error, same 2 as from previous use with this image.
5770SS1 *ERROR Extended Base Support
5770DE1 *ERROR DB2 XML Extender
From archives and previous notes, probably because the image was old.

I need to reinstall/restore these two LLP
Since IPL, remote virtual optical can no longer access the DSLO image on the remote LPAR.
OPTVRT01 goes Active, but not accessing the DSLO remote image.
Is this a SST service tools LAN adapter issue or another issue?
No comm has been configured as of yet, but I thought OPTVRT01 should still be functional



-----Original Message-----
From: midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of DrFranken
Sent: Saturday, January 04, 2014 12:02 PM
To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion
Subject: Re: HMC network install of i5OS V7R1 from DSLO image, can't fine load source B2003110

You tried to do almost anything? Quite a few bits now trigger the starting of QSYSWRK and sometimes QUSRWRK subsystems and yes that derails the install of the first few options for sure.

Oh and just an FYI for the crowd, you cannot install i5/OS or PTF it over a network. That is supported only in IBM i. :-)

- Larry "DrFranken" Bolhuis

www.frankeni.com
www.iDevCloud.com
www.iInTheCloud.com

On 1/3/2014 4:43 PM, Steinmetz, Paul wrote:
Larry,

Subsystem QSYSWRK was active, once ended, i5/OS install continued.
Any idea what might cause QSYSWRK to go active, which caused the i5/OS install to fail.

-----Original Message-----
From: Steinmetz, Paul
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2014 3:33 PM
To: 'Midrange Systems Technical Discussion'
Subject: RE: HMC network install of i5OS V7R1 from DSLO image, can't
fine load source B2003110

Larry,

Virtual Optical created on client.
Go licpgm 1 or 11 resulting with same error.
File QATOCSTART, library QUSRSYS not found.
Cannot install library QGPL.
Output queue changed to QPRINT in QGPL.
Work with licensed programs function not complete.
Cannot install library QGPL.
Output queue changed to QPRINT in QGPL.
Work with licensed programs function not complete.


-----Original Message-----
From: midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of DrFranken
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2014 2:38 PM
To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion
Subject: Re: HMC network install of i5OS V7R1 from DSLO image, can't
fine load source B2003110

One other thing to add if the partitions are all on the same server, I also always use the same virtual adapter number, such as 9 for this effort. Just easier to remember what it's there for and which VLAN to assign it to.

- Larry "DrFranken" Bolhuis

www.frankeni.com
www.iDevCloud.com
www.iInTheCloud.com

On 1/3/2014 2:26 PM, DrFranken wrote:

Looked at your *LIND and nothing busted there.

VLAN must be the same of course or the packets can't get between
adapters. That of course 'slows it down some.' :-)

As to the use of the adapters:

On the HOST partition. Normally the existing adapters can be used.
This partition does NOT Need a Service Tools adapter. TCP/IP on the
production Ethernet adapter is usually acceptable. Rules:
1) Must be in same VLAN.
2) Must have frame size 1496 or lower (No Jumbos)

On the Client side, the partition being installed upgraded or PTFed,
a dedicated adapter is needed for the Service Tools Adapter. It can
be physical or virtual.
Rules:
1) Dedicated for this purpose. If it's in use by TCP/IP at the iBM i
level it's not available.
2) Must be in the same VLAN
3) For Alternate IPL use, if it's a Physical card with multiple ports
it will use port 1 (Top Port)
- This is NOT a restriction if used only for PTFs as you can
select specific CMNxx resource in Service Tools.
4) Must be an IOPless adapter (i.e. any adapter capable of GbE) 100Mb
and older adapters need not apply.
5) HEA/IVE works as well for the adapter if a physical adapter is needed.

As to which VLAN it's really quite simple: Both the Host and the
Client must be on the same one. Doesn't matter if it's private or not.
Now MY RULE is that if these are all on one virtualized Power System
then MAKE IT PRIVATE! Isolate that traffic to this one VLAN for
troubleshooting, performance, etc. I choose a subnet such as
192.168.250.x and then every partition on the server gets a .x that matches their partition number.
No muss no fuss and easy to assign the addresses as well.

Once you get it down and stuffed in between the ears it's not that
hard and is wonderful stuff. Heck even Jim figured it out. :-) :-)

- Larry "DrFranken" Bolhuis

www.frankeni.com
www.iDevCloud.com
www.iInTheCloud.com

On 1/3/2014 2:07 PM, Steinmetz, Paul wrote:

Larry,

For network install, am I correct in stating
1) that you CANNOT use an existing virtual Ethernet that is already in use. (document states you must vary off before using, I could not because being used for LPAR communication.
2) I know VLAN id must all be the same, but can it be an existing VLAN or must it be a new VLAN. (I changed from 1 to 2, 1 was in use for above).

These were the 2 main changes I made that allowed chsysstate to work successfully.

Thanks
Paul

-----Original Message-----
From: Steinmetz, Paul
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2014 12:23 PM
To: 'Midrange Systems Technical Discussion'
Subject: RE: HMC network install of i5OS V7R1 from DSLO image, can't
fine load source B2003110

Larry,

This is neat stuff once it works, but the setup is complicated, I need to create better working docs.
Do I need another adapter for the remote virtual optical on the client?
Is chsysstate auto an available option?

Display Line Description Page 1
5770SS1 V7R1M0 100423 PENCOR07 01/03/14 11:55:07 EST
Line description . . . . . . . . . : LIND ETHVIRT00
Option . . . . . . . . . . . . . . : OPTION *ALL
Category of line . . . . . . . . . : *ELAN
Resource name . . . . . . . . . . : RSRCNAME CMN07
Online at IPL . . . . . . . . . . : ONLINE *YES
Vary on wait . . . . . . . . . . . : VRYWAIT *NOWAIT
Network controller . . . . . . . . : NETCTL ETHVINET
Local adapter address . . . . . . : ADPTADR F253876CC003
Exchange identifier . . . . . . . : EXCHID 056DDB0F
Ethernet standard . . . . . . . . : ETHSTD *ALL
Line speed . . . . . . . . . . . . : LINESPEED *AUTO
Current line speed . . . . . . . . : 1G
Duplex . . . . . . . . . . . . . . : DUPLEX *AUTO
Current duplex . . . . . . . . . . : *FULL
Serviceability options . . . . . . : SRVOPT *NONE
Maximum frame size . . . . . . . . : MAXFRAME 1496
Maximum controllers . . . . . . . : MAXCTL 40
Error threshold level . . . . . . : THRESHOLD *OFF
Generate test frame . . . . . . . : GENTSTFRM *YES
LEC frame size . . . . . . . . . . :
Message queue . . . . . . . . . . : MSGQ *SYSVAL
Current message queue . . . . . . : QSYSOPR
Library . . . . . . . . . . . . : QSYS
Text . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . : TEXT Virtual Ethernet Line
--------------Active Switched Controllers--------------
(No active switched controllers attached)
SSAP list . . . . . . . . . . . . : SSAP
----Source Service Access Points----- ----Source Service Access Points-----
SSAP Maximum Frame Type SSAP Maximum Frame Type
04 1496 *SNA AA 1496 *NONSNA
12 1496 *NONSNA C8 1496 *HPR
Group address . . . . . . . . . . : GRPADR
---------------Group Addresses----------------
(No group addresses found)
Link speed . . . . . . . . . . . . : LINKSPEED 10M
Cost/connect time . . . . . . . . : COSTCNN 0
Cost/byte . . . . . . . . . . . . : COSTBYTE 0
Security for line . . . . . . . . : SECURITY *NONSECURE
Propagation delay . . . . . . . . : PRPDLY *LAN
User-defined 1 . . . . . . . . . . : USRDFN1 128
User-defined 2 . . . . . . . . . . : USRDFN2 128
User-defined 3 . . . . . . . . . . : USRDFN3 128
Autocreate controller . . . . . . : AUTOCRTCTL *NO
Recovery limits . . . . . . . . . : CMNRCYLMT
Count limit . . . . . . . . . . : 2
Time interval . . . . . . . . . : 5
Display Line Description Page 2
770SS1 V7R1M0 100423 PENCOR07 01/03/14 11:55:07 EST
Line description . . . . . . . . . : LIND ETHVIRT00
Option . . . . . . . . . . . . . . : OPTION *ALL
Category of line . . . . . . . . . : *ELAN
Aggregated resource list . . . . . : AGGRSCL
-Aggregated Resource List--
Name Status
(No aggregated resource list entries)
* * * * * E N D O F L I S T I N G * * * * *

-----Original Message-----
From: midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of DrFranken
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2014 11:41 AM
To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion
Subject: Re: HMC network install of i5OS V7R1 from DSLO image, can't
fine load source B2003110

Can you send output of DSPLIND on the original virtual line on the host?

Yes the manual install will only install the LIC and base O/S. Once that is installed then create the network based virtual optical drive and complete the install from option 11 (selective) or option 1 (everything) from go LICPGM.

Note that you have all the 'hard parts' done for this network based virtual optical you merely need to do the CRTDEVOPT piece and vary it on.


- Larry "DrFranken" Bolhuis

www.frankeni.com
www.iDevCloud.com
www.iInTheCloud.com

On 1/3/2014 11:37 AM, Steinmetz, Paul wrote:

Network install of V7R1 Client Partition using DSLO image partially successful.

For the network install to initiate, I had to create 2 new virtual line descriptions, 2 interfaces, 2 new ip, using a different virtual adapter, VLAN 2.
I'm not sure why my primary virtual Ethernet would not work?
Any thoughts?

Pencor06 - Partition that holds the image catalog.
ETHVIRTHMC
172.15.23.6 255.255.255.0 ETHVIRTHMC *ELAN

Pencor07 - Hosted partition
ETHVIRTHMC
172.15.23.7 255.255.255.0 ETHVIRTHMC *ELAN

chsysstate -o on -k manual -m Server-8205-E6C-SN105815R -n Pencor08
DSLO -i d -f Pencor08 DSLO -r lpar --ip 172.15.23.8 --netmask
255.255.255.0 --gateway 172.15.23.6 --serverip 172.15.23.6
--serverdir /V7R1OSPTF --duplex auto --mtu 1500

LIC installed ok.
V7R1 base OS installed.

5770SS1 *BACKLEVEL Library QGPL
5770SS1 *BACKLEVEL Library QUSRSYS
5770SS1 *COMPATIBLE IBM

Why did all of i5/OS not install?
Was this because the chsysstate was manual?
Could this work with chsystate set as auto?

At this point, I believe I need to create a remote virtual optical.
Then 1. Install all


-----Original Message-----
From: Steinmetz, Paul
Sent: Wednesday, January 01, 2014 7:58 PM
To: 'Midrange Systems Technical Discussion'
Subject: RE: HMC network install of i5OS V7R1 from DSLO image,
can't fine load source B2003110

HMC network install of client partition, keep getting this error message.
HSCL146A The I/O adapter: null is not valid.

-----Original Message-----
From: Steinmetz, Paul
Sent: Monday, December 30, 2013 2:41 PM
To: 'Midrange Systems Technical Discussion'
Subject: RE: HMC network install of i5OS V7R1 from DSLO image,
can't fine load source B2003110

Jim,

Space in the LPAR name is fine, confirmed that this works.

-----Original Message-----
From: midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jim
Oberholtzer
Sent: Monday, December 30, 2013 12:46 PM
To: 'Midrange Systems Technical Discussion'
Subject: RE: HMC network install of i5OS V7R1 from DSLO image,
can't fine load source B2003110

Are you sure the "Pencor08 DSLO" is correct? I'm guessing the HMC command parser sees that space in the name between the 8 and the D and interprets the name incorrectly.

--
Jim Oberholtzer
Chief Technical Architect
Agile Technology Architects


-----Original Message-----
From: midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Steinmetz,
Paul
Sent: Monday, December 30, 2013 11:10 AM
To: 'Midrange Systems Technical Discussion'
Subject: RE: HMC network install of i5OS V7R1 from DSLO image,
can't fine load source B2003110


Larry,

Pencor08 DSLO does not have a physical Ethernet, only virtual. The 10.5.23.8 does not exist, error on my part.
Pencor07 (10.5.23.7) is the host for the Pencor08 client.
Pencor06 (10.5.23.6) is the location for the DSLO image.

On Pencor07 host, I created the Ethernet bridge, per Pete's instructions.
Is this bridge needed for the network install or do I simply need a virtual Ethernet on Pencor08 client.

For the chsystate, can the IPs be a mixture (option 1) of actual Ethernet and virtual, or do they need to be all virtual (option 2).

Option 1
chsysstate -o on -k manual -m Server-8205-E6C-SN105815R -n Pencor08
DSLO -i d -f Pencor08 DSLO -r lpar --ip 172.16.23.8 --netmask
255.255.255.0 --gateway 10.5.23.6 --serverip 10.5.23.6 --serverdir
/V7R1OSPTF --duplex auto --mtu 1500

Option 2
chsysstate -o on -k manual -m Server-8205-E6C-SN105815R -n
Pencor08 DSLO -i d -f Pencor08 DSLO -r lpar --ip 172.16.23.8
--netmask
255.255.255.0 --gateway 172.16.23.6 --serverip 172.16.23.6
--serverdir /V7R1OSPTF --duplex auto --mtu 1500




-----Original Message-----
From: midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of DrFranken
Sent: Monday, December 30, 2013 9:05 AM
To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion
Subject: Re: HMC network install of i5OS V7R1 from DSLO image,
can't fine load source B2003110

Tagged I/O needs to be the Ethernet card that (in your case) gets the IP 10.5.23.8. Then the IP address 10.5.23.6 needs to be on that same network.
Now they CAN be virtual IP adapters that's legal but of course you'd probably want the 10.5.23.6 adapter to also be virtual on the same server.
It will work across an IBM i network bridge or VIOS SEA (which
actually is a
bridge) but it's simpler with two virtual LAN adapters.

Not sure if it's fixed but in earlier V7 HMC code you could not tag the virtual Ethernet while running through the create partition wizard. You have to 'lie' to complete it then go back into the profile and tag the Virtual Ethernet as it allows it then.

The real deal is that it doesn't make any difference if this is a client partition to IBM i, client to VIOS, NPIV connected, vSCSI connected etc etc.
You are simply using this support for the alt-IPL source it doesn't care about where the IBM i will find it's storage in the end.

I have done a bunch of these this way and it works very well.

- Larry "DrFranken" Bolhuis

www.frankeni.com
www.iDevCloud.com
www.iInTheCloud.com

On 12/30/2013 2:10 AM, Steinmetz, Paul wrote:

Larry,

How should the tagged IO be configured for network install for
client
partition?

-----Original Message-----
From: midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Steinmetz,
Paul
Sent: Monday, December 30, 2013 1:57 AM
To: 'Midrange Systems Technical Discussion'
Subject: RE: HMC network install of i5OS V7R1 from DSLO image,
can't fine load source B2003110

Larry,

Thanks for all the help and tips.

I had two issues,
1) alt restart device wasn't tagged.
2) chsysstate - 1 extra space after serverdir/ V7R1OSPTF

Now that I have the setup and syntax correct, chsystate was successful.
I'm now trying to the same to a hosted client partition,
error
B2004158
This is my first attempt of this for a client partition, not sure if this is possible?
I followed Pete Massiello PDF "Building Virtual IBM i partitions
on hosted
IBM i."
However, instead of loading from actual medial, trying a network install.
Is this possible?
The client doesn't have an actual Ethernet, so no actual IP.

chsysstate -o on -k manual -m Server-8205-E6C-SN105815R -n
Pencor08 DSLO -i d -f Pencor08 DSLO -r lpar --ip 10.5.23.8
--netmask
255.255.255.0 --gateway 10.5.23.6 --serverip 10.5.23.6 --serverdir
/V7R1OSPTF --duplex auto --mtu 1500



-----Original Message-----
From: midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of DrFranken
Sent: Sunday, December 29, 2013 8:31 PM
To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion
Subject: Re: HMC network install of i5OS V7R1 from DSLO image,
can't fine load source B2003110

Paul,

Did the email client or the list remove characters after Pencor07?
Otherwise you have too many parameters there. Also it appears
there is an
extra space after the / in / OSV7.... Again could be an email
client
thing.

Can you confirm that the line description used for the NFS
Host is
configured for 1500 byte or smaller frames?

Can you confirm that the NFS and TFTP servers are in fact
running on
the Host.

Finally can you confirm that profile "Pencor07(some
missing
character)Upgrade" has the appropriate Ethernet line tagged as the Alternate Restart Device?

- Larry "DrFranken" Bolhuis

www.frankeni.com
www.iDevCloud.com
www.iInTheCloud.com

On 12/29/2013 6:16 PM, Steinmetz, Paul wrote:

HMC network install of i5OS V7R1 from DSLO image, can't fine load
source B2003110

Successfully completed similar process earlier this year.
Since HMC and LPAR both updated.
Redid prereqs several times.
I don't think the HMC is detecting the image catalog, mounted and
ready .

VFYIMGCLG IMGCLG(V7R1DLSO) TYPE(*UPGRADE) NFSSHR(*YES)

CHGAUT OBJ('/V7R1OSPTF') USER(*PUBLIC) DTAAUT(*RX) SUBTREE(*ALL)
CHGAUT OBJ('/V7R1OSPTF/BOOTP') USER(QTFTP) DTAAUT(*RX)
SUBTREE(*ALL) CHGTFTPA ALTSRCDIR('/V7R1OSPTF/BOOTP')

ENDTCPSVR SERVER(*TFTP)

STRTCPSVR SERVER(*TFTP)
STRNFSSVR SERVER(*ALL)
CHGNFSEXP OPTIONS('-i -o ro') DIR('/V7R1OSPTF')

chsysstate -o on -k manual -m Server-8205-E6C-SN105815R -n
Pencor07 Upgrade -i d -f Pencor07 Upgrade -r lpar --ip 10.5.23.7
--netmask
255.255.255.0 --gateway 10.5.23.6 --serverip 10.5.23.6
--serverdir / V7R1OSPTF --duplex auto --mtu 1500

Thank You
_____
Paul Steinmetz
IBM i Systems Administrator

Pencor Services, Inc.
462 Delaware Ave
Palmerton Pa 18071

610-826-9117 work
610-826-9188 fax
610-349-0913 cell
610-377-6012 home

psteinmetz@xxxxxxxxxx<mailto:psteinmetz@xxxxxxxxxx>
http://www.pencor.com/



Thank You
_____
Paul Steinmetz
IBM i Systems Administrator

Pencor Services, Inc.
462 Delaware Ave
Palmerton Pa 18071

610-826-9117 work
610-826-9188 fax
610-349-0913 cell
610-377-6012 home

psteinmetz@xxxxxxxxxx<mailto:psteinmetz@xxxxxxxxxx>
http://www.pencor.com/

--
This is the Midrange Systems Technical Discussion (MIDRANGE-L)
mailing list To post a message email: MIDRANGE-L@xxxxxxxxxxxx To
subscribe, unsubscribe, or change list options,
visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/midrange-l
or email: MIDRANGE-L-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx Before posting, please
take a
moment to review the archives at http://archive.midrange.com/midrange-l.

--
This is the Midrange Systems Technical Discussion (MIDRANGE-L)
mailing list To post a message email: MIDRANGE-L@xxxxxxxxxxxx To
subscribe, unsubscribe, or change list options,
visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/midrange-l
or email: MIDRANGE-L-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx Before posting, please
take a
moment to review the archives at http://archive.midrange.com/midrange-l.

--
This is the Midrange Systems Technical Discussion (MIDRANGE-L)
mailing list To post a message email: MIDRANGE-L@xxxxxxxxxxxx To
subscribe, unsubscribe, or change list options,
visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/midrange-l
or email: MIDRANGE-L-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx Before posting, please take a moment to review the archives at http://archive.midrange.com/midrange-l.

--
This is the Midrange Systems Technical Discussion (MIDRANGE-L)
mailing list To post a message email: MIDRANGE-L@xxxxxxxxxxxx To
subscribe, unsubscribe, or change list options,
visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/midrange-l
or email: MIDRANGE-L-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx Before posting, please take a moment to review the archives at http://archive.midrange.com/midrange-l.


--
This is the Midrange Systems Technical Discussion (MIDRANGE-L)
mailing list To post a message email: MIDRANGE-L@xxxxxxxxxxxx To
subscribe, unsubscribe, or change list options,
visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/midrange-l
or email: MIDRANGE-L-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx Before posting, please take a moment to review the archives at http://archive.midrange.com/midrange-l.

--
This is the Midrange Systems Technical Discussion (MIDRANGE-L)
mailing list To post a message email: MIDRANGE-L@xxxxxxxxxxxx To
subscribe, unsubscribe, or change list options,
visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/midrange-l
or email: MIDRANGE-L-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx Before posting, please take a moment to review the archives at http://archive.midrange.com/midrange-l.

--
This is the Midrange Systems Technical Discussion (MIDRANGE-L) mailing
list To post a message email: MIDRANGE-L@xxxxxxxxxxxx To subscribe,
unsubscribe, or change list options,
visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/midrange-l
or email: MIDRANGE-L-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx Before posting, please take a moment to review the archives at http://archive.midrange.com/midrange-l.

--
This is the Midrange Systems Technical Discussion (MIDRANGE-L) mailing list To post a message email: MIDRANGE-L@xxxxxxxxxxxx To subscribe, unsubscribe, or change list options,
visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/midrange-l
or email: MIDRANGE-L-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx Before posting, please take a moment to review the archives at http://archive.midrange.com/midrange-l.


As an Amazon Associate we earn from qualifying purchases.

This thread ...
Follow-Ups:
Replies:
Follow On AppleNews
Return to Archive home page | Return to MIDRANGE.COM home page

This mailing list archive is Copyright 1997-2024 by midrange.com and David Gibbs as a compilation work. Use of the archive is restricted to research of a business or technical nature. Any other uses are prohibited. Full details are available on our policy page. If you have questions about this, please contact [javascript protected email address].

Operating expenses for this site are earned using the Amazon Associate program and Google Adsense.