RE: Backup question

This just seems like more FUD. Here is what I was told went on:

In working with IBM, we were informed that if we needed to restore the system
that IBM would only help us during a Disaster Recovery if their backup function
was used.

Now, I looked at GO RESTORE option 21 and GO SAVE option 21. I can't see
anything in the GO SAVE option 21 that was not being done already, in the same
sequence. I looked at the help text for both the save and restore and the text
is where I am getting my understanding as to the commands that are involved.

My concern is that when the HBOC BBACKUP command front end is used, we have
accurate logging information as to when (or if) the backup was performed. We
have already had it happen where, for whatever reason, the operator has
indicated on the log sheet (by a check mark) that some function, including
backup, was performed. But, the truth came out later that the checked function
was not always performed.

Why would IBM (or somebody at IBM) take the position, without looking at the
save itself, that they would not get involved with a DR recovery? Is there
some magic tag that gets written to the save media when GO SAVE is used that is
not written otherwise?

John McKee


Quoting John McKee <jmmckee@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>:

Rob, and others, thanks for the input. I still don't know what triggered the
original conversation that I was not included on. Seems like what we were
doing was exactly what was needed. Makes me think that somebody just
volunteered something and magic buttons got pushed.


John McKee
Quoting "Ketzes, Larry" <Larry.Ketzes@xxxxxxx>:

Rob,
I agree with all of your points, but if you go into the 'Go Save'
menu, and take option 20, it will bring you to the Define save system and
user data defaults screen. You can then change the 'Prompt for Commands'
parameter from a 'Y' to a 'N', and the backup will simply go from one save
command to the next without prompting.

Larry

Larry Ketzes | Senior iSeries System Administrator | AIG / ALICO - American
Life Insurance Company
One ALICO Plaza, 600 N. King Street, AMIS | Wilmington, DE 19801 | *:
302.594.2146 | 7: 302.830.4524| *: larry.ketzes@xxxxxxx


-----Original Message-----
From: midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of rob@xxxxxxxxx
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 2:33 PM
To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion
Subject: RE: Backup question

John,

As you can see by the confusion of some people as to what is included in a
SAVSYS, and,
by the "if it ain't broke don't fix it" mentality of some people who are
still using their pre IFS backup programs,
I can see why IBM encourages a GO SAVE option 21.

Biggest problems I have with GO SAVE 21 are:
- the lack of logging of times on each step (see earlier comments on V6R1
- STRSBS at the end. Most times I do an IPL afterwards and I sure don't
want to do that. Also, I almost never prompt for commands. What a time
waster if you leave the room between steps.

Rob Berendt
--
Group Dekko Services, LLC
Dept 01.073
Dock 108
6928N 400E
Kendallville, IN 46755
http://www.dekko.com





John McKee <jmmckee@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent by: midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx
08/26/2008 02:21 PM
Please respond to
Midrange Systems Technical Discussion <midrange-l@xxxxxxxxxxxx>


To
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Subject
RE: Backup question






The Operations Manager had told me, in his words, that we needed to use
Go SAVE
to continue to receive support. Exactly what was said, and why, I was not
included on that. My curiosity was definitely peaked. For one thing, how
could IBM determine that our backup was NOT performed via option 21? I
suppose
that some object used date could be checked. But, as far as the
content of the
backup itself, it would seem to be the same no matter which method was
used. Which is why I am confused and asking what seemed a no-brainer
question.

John McKee

Quoting "Ingvaldson, Scott" <scott.ingvaldson@xxxxxxxxxx>:

I was told that IBM pretty much demanded that Go SAVE option 21 be

used instead.

What? Who told you that? IBM might recommend the option 21 save but
they would never "demand" it. Many, many installations cannot ever run
an option 21 save due to the needs of their business or application.

It would appear that you have all that you need for a full system
restore per "Are you saving the Right Stuff?"
http://wiki.midrange.com/index.php/Are_You_Saving_The_Right_Stuff%3F

I would expect that you could even run a native Option 21 restore on a
tape created with this backup, assuming "appropriate options" are truly
used. You *might* need to specify Prompt for commands: YES, it's been a
while since I've tested this. As with any and all backup and restore
procedures this should be tested and documented.

If you want to analyze the IBM full system backup do RTVCLSRC
PGM(QMNSAVE)

Regards,

Scott Ingvaldson
Senior IBM Support Specialist
Fiserv Midwest


-----Original Message-----
From: John McKee [mailto:jmmckee@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 9:01 AM
To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion
Subject: Backup question

Our software package is provided by HBOC. They have a number of
commands that are based on IBM commands, with subtle changes. They
differentiate them by prefacing their versions with a 'B'.

Using their commands, a full save of the system was accomplished with
BBACKUP.
This command brings up a number of options. Ultimately, a set of user
defined commands is run. In our case, the commands were: SAVSYS,
SAVLIB, SAVDLO, and SAV, with appropriate options.

I was told that IBM pretty much demanded that Go SAVE option 21 be used
instead.

According to the command help, the only commands that appear different
are that the controlling subsystem is ended and restarted. That process
was performed by operators when BBACKUP command was used.

Is there something else that is going on that is different from the
scripted backup? One reason to ask is that the BBACKUP command logs
start and stop time of each step - which is sometimes an issue.

Thanks,

John McKee


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