RE: Left AS/400 and Returned -- MIDRANGE-L

The reason that most vendors and shops don't have normalized databases
is because most vendors and shops don't use the data store on the
iSeries as a database - it's used as a system of indexed files.
Normalization in that scenario can hurt performance, because the
program would need to chain to several files to gather the information
needed to present to the user. There's no doubt that normalization is a
good thing for a database (at least 3NF), but normalization for indexed
files isn't as important or desired.

> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: Re: Left AS/400 and Returned
> From: Alan Campin <Alan.Campin@xxxxxxx>
> Date: Tue, May 03, 2005 2:12 pm
> To: midrange-l@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> 
> Brad, I agree with concerning the platform. No reason an AS/400 application 
> cannot have as good or better database design than any PC package. The 
> problem is that they don't. 
> 
> What really frosts my ass is that you have professional software companies 
> producing commercial software package for the AS/400 and they have no idea 
> how to create normalized data bases and use them. I can understand when you 
> have a shop with a group of programmers and they have not been trained in 
> database design but how the hell does a professional software company produce 
> software based on unnormalized databases? Why would management allow such a 
> thing?
> 
> I have worked for commercial software companies and small shops and my 
> experience was that about the only way you could get people to consider 
> normalized databases was to throw a hand grenade in and go into with assault 
> guns blazing and even then it was hand to hand in the trenches.
> 
> Just too much of a hassle to bother. Just create the physical data base to 
> look like the logical view and worry about the consequences later.
> 
> I worked at company where I built a data warehouse based normalized tables. I 
> could produce any kind of report I wanted. It worked beautifully. I left the 
> company but came back to visit and talked to the new programmer they had 
> hired. He said he was working on the data warehouse and I asked him what he 
> was doing. He was demoralizing all the table to create one big table. "I 
> don't how to do those joins so I am just putting everything in one table". I 
> heard a similar statement at my company recently. 
> 
> The thing that can drive you crazy is why companies cannot see the incredible 
> costs that they suffer from building the database incorrectly but you watch 
> companies just keep producing more and more junk. 
> 
> O well, guess I have bitched enough for today.  
> 
> >> First, let me say that the platform used has nothing to do
> >> with the normalization of databases.  What you saw was a
> >> great example of someone with the knowledge and authority
> >> (or persuasion to authority) to do it "right" from the
> >> start.  It just happened to be a non-iSeries group.
> 
> >> Second, I hate to say but I agree with what you have seen
> >> on the platform is similar to most I have seen.  People
> >> create applications at the same time or BEFORE they even
> >> get the DB designed.  Which, is bass ackwards.
> -- 
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