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Chapin,

I must disagree. Since you can't directly debug an action diagram, how would you track down a difficult to find bug? The only practical way is to go into the generated code.

As an example I have worked with Progen. It generates very decent code. It is even documented! The options you have are fully documented or VERY fully documented. There is no reason that code generators can't generate decent, human readable code.

 -mark


At 4/29/05 12:03 AM, you wrote:

With apologies for jumping in late... I'd just like to take umbrage with the disparaging statements about generated code.

I used Synon/2e (now Advantage:2e) for eight years before I learned RPG.
That was reality for me. I still use it without viewing the generated code,
and in fact interact with vendor code generated in COBOL (which I also don't
look at). The "code" I care about is in the Action Diagram. The biggest
benefit of a CASE tool is the ability to work at a higher level of abstraction
than the 3GL provides.


Just as I don't look at the machine code generated by the compiler, I should
not look at the HLL code generated by the CASE tool. When I do, it is
because of my ignorance of the CASE tool or a bug in its generater, and neither
should be tolerated.


The programmers whom I see looking at generated code are usually looking for
warm-fuzzies about what they just created, or don't understand how the CASE
tool works, and are using the generated code to understand what it does.
Neither is an efficient use of their time. They should learn how to program
IN THE TOOL, not use it to "manipulate code."


I have lots of respect for your posts, Rob, and David, and I missed Peter's
original post, so this may not be germane to his original point. But, I
contend that all of you miss the point of using a CASE tool when you disparage
its generated code.


--Chapin Kaynor
  Vermont



date:  Fri, 22 Apr 2005 14:54:19 -0500
from: rob@xxxxxxxxx
subject: Re: Cases  in AS400

I agree David.  I used to use AS/SET and that code was,  and still is,
ugly.  In fact they still convert 10 character field  names down to 6
characters.

Sometimes I wonder if they do this  stuff just to discourage you from
looking at the generated code, stay the  he!! out, and only use the case
tool to manipulate code.

Rob  Berendt
--
Group Dekko Services, LLC
Dept 01.073
PO Box  2000
Dock 108
6928N 400E
Kendallville, IN  46755
http://www.dekko.com





David Gibbs  <david@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent by:  midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx
04/22/2005 01:47 PM
Please respond  to
Midrange Systems Technical Discussion  <midrange-l@xxxxxxxxxxxx>


To midrange-l@xxxxxxxxxxxx cc

Subject
Re:  Cases in AS400






Peter Vidal wrote: > SYNON? Ugly code....

I think all case tools generate ugly code ... but the  theory is, you use
the case tool to manage generate the code, so who cares  how ugly it is.

That is, of course, a theory only.

Reality,  obviously, is another story.

david

--
David  Gibbs
david@xxxxxxxxxxxx




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