Re: Web Development Software

["David Prowak" <dprowak@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

> >I disagree.  One of the most important aspects of HTML is that it
> >describes the structure of a document, and not the actual appearance of a
> >document.  By using a WYSIWYG tool, you may get
> >too hung up on how the document looks, which almost always differs when
> >the document is viewed in different browsers.  Or even on the same
browser
> >on different systems.
>
> HTML describes both. Do the bold and italics tags describe the structure
of
> an HTML document? Does using tables to generate white space (and increase
> readability) describe the structure of an HTML document, or does it have
> more to do more with appearance?
>

No, no, no, no.
HTML's purpose, as a SGML appliction, is to describe the structure
of a document.  Don't agree?   What's ML in HTML stand for?  Markup
Language.

HTML went through a large change between versions 3 & 4 to address
the fact that so many people were mis-using HTML for a purpose in which it
was not attended, namely
to effect the appearance of a document.  The abuse of HTML for a purpose
that it was not attended resulted
in many tags being deprecated in HTML 4.0.  Presentation attributes ARE NOT
in the realm of HTML!!!
Can HTML be incorrectly used to provide presentation attributes?  It is
everyday.  That doesn't mean it's right.

The separation of the structure of a document and presentation is central to
good web site design.

Dave


----- Original Message -----
From: Chuck Lundgren <lundgren@iris-software.com>
To: <MIDRANGE-L@midrange.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 28, 2000 10:19 AM
Subject: RE: Web Development Software


>
> > >2. I would argue the opposite of your stance: that a program like
> > >FrontPage, where you can first paint the screen, *then* see the HTML
behind
> > >it, is vastly superior to first learning the HTML with an ASCII editor.
> > >Taking that a bit further, I'd say the real way to learn HTML is to
save a
> > >web page into FrontPage, and toggle over into the HTML to see how it
works.
> >
> >I disagree.  One of the most important aspects of HTML is that it
> >describes the structure of a document, and not the actual appearance of a
> >document.  By using a WYSIWYG tool, you may get
> >too hung up on how the document looks, which almost always differs when
> >the document is viewed in different browsers.  Or even on the same
browser
> >on different systems.
>
> HTML describes both. Do the bold and italics tags describe the structure
of
> an HTML document? Does using tables to generate white space (and increase
> readability) describe the structure of an HTML document, or does it have
> more to do more with appearance?
>
> > >3. FP 2000 can be extended with VBA. Again, pretty slick.
> >
> >Does that work on non-Windows clients?
>
> Why should it? FP runs in Windows, and you can extend the editing
> environment using VBA, just as you can in Word, Excel and Access.
>
> > >4. I have found that I can quickly design a page in FrontPage, then
tweak
> > >the HTML and/or import it into ColdFusion when it's ready. FP is a
> > >phenomenal prototyping tool. As much as Microsoft gets a bad rep, there
> > > are a few tools the company does VERY well: FrontPage, Visual Basic,
> > > Word/Excel and Access.
> >
> >I've also read of shops where FP is banned because of how it messes up
> >with HTML.
>
> Yes, it used to mess with HTML a lot more, but you have much more control
> over it now. Look, FP has grown up. Why treat it as a version 1 product
> when it's at version 4 (aka FP 2000)? Everyone knows that the third and
> fourth versions of Microsoft products are the first usable versions <g>.
>
> >One thing turned me off of WYSIWYG editors:  I was chatting with
> >an exhibitor at a model train show a couple of years ago.  They
> >were advertising the URL of their web page, but they told me that
> >the web page wasn't up yet. They were running some MS HTML editor,
> >which hung the system.  They found that the motherboard was fried!
> >They complained to microsft.  MS eventually agreed to replace the
> >MB, but only after the company threatened to go to the press with
> >their complaint!
>
> FrontPage fried the motherboard? I hope you're kidding about this, but I
> don't see any <g>'s in your text.
>
> >As someone else pointed out, perhaps the best way to edit HTML is
> >by using your favorite plain-text editor.  HTML is not difficult
> >to learn (although there are a few quirks peculiar to some
> >browsers).  Also, it's probably a good idea to get used to XHTML
> >syntax, even if you're targetting to older forms of HTML.
> >
> >Even if you do use some WYSIWYG editor, remember to check out the
> >HTML using a validator like <http://validator.w3.org/>.
>
> Agree on validator. Disagree on the best way to learn HTML.
>
>   ... Chuck
>
>
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