Re: Re[2]: The relevance of COMMON (was Penton to buy Duke - New

How in the world can you be frustrated with COMMON if you've never
been????!!!????  That means you've never invested a dime's worth of money nor a
dime's worth of time to see what you could get out of it.  As Bruce Collins
stated in another message, you get out of it what you put into it.  Personally,
I think you should be screaming, jumping up and down and hollering(that's an
Ozark mountain phrase), if your "decision makers" won't send you for training.
I've never understood how we are supposed to advance our abilities and skills
without outside training.  People who make these decisions should have mean,
nasty, ugly things done to them.  The benefits from COMMON are far too numerous
to mention here and they are multiplied when you volunteer and really get to
know the movers and shakers in our industry.  They are some of the most
friendly, helpful people I've ever met.

Paul Fenstermacher
Bass Pro Shops
paulf@basspro.com




eric.delong@pmsi-services.com on 09/05/2000 05:55:15 AM

Please respond to MIDRANGE-L@midrange.com

To:   MIDRANGE-L@midrange.com
cc:    (bcc: TechSupport/BassPro)

Subject:  Re[2]: The relevance of COMMON (was Penton to buy Duke - New





     John,

     Y'all probably remember my rants about this from time to time these
     past few years, but I must reiterate my frustration with COMMON.
     I've never been to common, though I've wanted to for some time. To
     me, it seems the decision makers would rather send themselves (even
     though they are out of programming) than send the kid. Why invest
     in my education, when they can take a little vacation on the
     company's dime. They know I work hard to stay current on my own
     time, so why should they pay for it.

     Those who have the power/time/$$$ don't want to give it up. They
     DON'T want me networking (I might find a better opportunity).
     They're not even going to pay for LUG fees (for the same reasons).
     This has been the attitude at EVERY job I've worked for the last
     15+ years. I've come to expect this attitude, even though I
     certainly don't agree with it.

     My only solace is these resources hosted by David G. and a few
     online resources. Is it enough????????

     eric.delong@pmsi-services.com


______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Re: The relevance of COMMON (was Penton to buy Duke - News40
Author:  <MIDRANGE-L@midrange.com> at INET_WACO
Date:    9/2/00 7:51 PM



David

I understand your perspective.   Here's why I think COMMON has been worth
the time and $.
To me,  COMMON provides a focal point for the AS/400 community.   This is a
fast changing business,  even more so than before.    It is invaluable to
me to talk directly to the people who are "In The Know"  .    In just one
night  I can talk to a language developer from Toronto,  a Java/OS/400
developer from Rochester,   ten people who are trying to bring up the same
ERP,  E-commerce, you name it    software package as me.        AND three
or four people from Europe/Far East  who are working in an environment my
company is trying to get established in.      That's been my experience at
just one night at CUDS.

That says nothing about the sessions,  labs,  talking to people between
sessions,  hearing questions and answers at the sessions, etc.   You can't
get that ANYWHERE.   Not at tech conferences, or LUGs.

By just showing an interest,   you can have a big impact sometimes on
future developments.

I know some people go and don't feel they fit in.  or feel they are on the
outside looking in.   I've been in both positions.    However you need
sometimes just to "Cast off"  the wall flower, outsider, first timer
tendencies and jump in and walk up to people and say  "Hi,   I'm xxxx from
yyyy,  could I ask you a question?    Even the speakers who have been
attending for 10 or more years will stop and answer questions, give
opinions, and be genuinely interested.

It's kinda like the Mecca for the midrange.    A place to go,  meet people,
network,  and get a real feel of the "State of the Business".

To me it's a chance to Learn,  to Give back to other people,  and to
network, network, network.
The AS/400 community will lose more than a conference if COMMON disappears
in my opinion,   it will lose its heart or soul kinda.

Lists are great,   But nothing will ever replace a hand shake, face time,
and sharing an experience.

Just MHO
For what it's worth.

John Carr


Hi John,  While working the IBM midrange since about 1985, I have never
attended COMMON,  as my employers never perceived the benefit to be worth
the expense.  Local seminars were more palatable (less time & $$).  I'm on
my own now and would have to justify the cost, down time, and time away
from
family.  I'm sure COMMON would be educational and fun, and meeting folks
face to face would be exciting, but it's hard to justify the tradeoff.
<SNIP>
David Keck


+---
| This is the Midrange System Mailing List!
| To submit a new message, send your mail to MIDRANGE-L@midrange.com.
| To subscribe to this list send email to MIDRANGE-L-SUB@midrange.com.
| To unsubscribe from this list send email to MIDRANGE-L-UNSUB@midrange.com.
| Questions should be directed to the list owner/operator: david@midrange.com
+---



+---
| This is the Midrange System Mailing List!
| To submit a new message, send your mail to MIDRANGE-L@midrange.com.
| To subscribe to this list send email to MIDRANGE-L-SUB@midrange.com.
| To unsubscribe from this list send email to MIDRANGE-L-UNSUB@midrange.com.
| Questions should be directed to the list owner/operator: david@midrange.com
+---









+---
| This is the Midrange System Mailing List!
| To submit a new message, send your mail to MIDRANGE-L@midrange.com.
| To subscribe to this list send email to MIDRANGE-L-SUB@midrange.com.
| To unsubscribe from this list send email to MIDRANGE-L-UNSUB@midrange.com.
| Questions should be directed to the list owner/operator: david@midrange.com
+---