Re: Drag-and-drop editing - PLEASE! -- WDSCI-L

Violaine,

Any feedback of the possibility to have the Prototypes section of the outline 
view show parameter
names and attributes instead of just attributes?

Assuming Outline could show them, I assume it wouldn't take much more for the 
parameter names to come
up in Code-Assist to.

IMHO, the above is the biggest missing feature.

Adding it would make life much better when trying to use procedures out of 
service program you didn't
write or that your wrote a while ago.

Thanks,
Charles Wilt

-----Original Message-----
From: wdsci-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:wdsci-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Violaine Batthish
Sent: Monday, March 19, 2007 2:59 PM
To: Websphere Development Studio Client for iSeries
Subject: Re: [WDSCI-L] Drag-and-drop editing - PLEASE!

Hi Bob,

I went though our list of requirements, and while there was 
drag and drop requests from one view in WDSC (ie from table 
view) to the editor, there wasn't one for your particular request.
I have added it to our list.

thanks,

Violaine Batthish
WebSphere Development Studio Client, IBM Toronto Lab

wdsci-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx wrote on 03/19/2007 01:09:09 PM:

Joe,

If you choose to abandon a tool because it doesn't have

one of your
favorite

UI conveniences then that's your prerogative.  What are you

gonna do,
Bob, go

back to SEU?

No. I would go back to CodeStudio (but I don't want to)--which has 
some limitations, but its much more Windows-like for editing, it is 
(imho)

vastly

superior to the RSE editor, unless you really LOVE SEU and want

thatinterface.

I love SEU's interface on the Green Screen.
I HATE!!!!!!!!!! SEU's interface in a GUI--it slows you

down some 50to
90% in

productivity. Moving over to line commands? Sheeze!
For example, how do you delete a line of source?
In CodeStudio you press Ctrl+D.
I cannot find an equivalent in WDSC.
I know I can move over to the SEU seqnbr and enter a D, then press 
Enter. But I want to go back to green screen SEU every time

I have to

do that.

Or are you going to just abandon a great product that everybody is

using

because you can't drag and drop a line?

Ah... "everybody" isn't using it. If you find 5,000 users (out of 
what? 300,000 to 600,000 world-wide) using it, I'd be surprised.
"everybody" is subjective.

No Joe, I want it to work, I want it to be successful. I am

planningon
being a

advocate for it. I'm just very surprised that in 2006 a

tool as strong

as

WDSC

has many (all?) of the limitations and shortcomings that

Editing that
CODE/400

had so many years ago.

Some of my experiences are simply a lack of time using

RSE--but that

will change, I tend to pick things up quickly.

And please don't compare a toy like Notepad that is bundled with a 
$200

OS to

WDSC. Notepad is Windows' "UPDDTA" or SEU. It is not

Microsoft Visual
Studio.

You expect and accept limitations in Notepad and SEU, you

don't expect

or accept them in the professional development environment.

At some point the RPG community has to let go of the SEU/PDM/SDA 
nipple. But if the replacement offers that same

user-interface, you'll

only get limited buy-in.
People that hate green screen editing will move to anything (even 
Notepad), but the majority will not see a compelling reason to go 
through a large

learning

curve only to do exactly what they are already doing,

nearly the same

way

they

are doing it, but with lipstick.

The good news in WDSC 7, to me, is WDSC is a great improvement over 
the

old

CODE/400 package. I can load it, edit, close it down, open

it back up,
and it

does all of that very quickly. It also doesn't take long to

pull down

member

and save it back to the host.


-Bob Cozzi
www.i5PodCast.com
Ask your manager to watch i5 TV



-----Original Message-----
From: wdsci-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:wdsci-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx]

On

Behalf Of Joe Pluta
Sent: Monday, March 19, 2007 10:42 AM
To: 'Websphere Development Studio Client for iSeries'
Subject: Re: [WDSCI-L] Drag-and-drop editing - PLEASE!

From: Bob Cozzi

Joe,
I know you have much more experience with WDSC and I, but

I have to

disagree.


You don't have to.  You just want to <grin>.

I think if you want people to use a product you need some

level of

familiarity--no doubt. But if you also don't have

anything new, such

as expected GUI-based editor behavior (in this case), then you'll 
turn off those

who

will
actually be taking the early steps towards using the tool.


I guess it depends on what "expected" means.  WDSC has 100% of the 
text editing capabilities of Notepad.  And the only thing

additional

that

Wordpad

has is drag and drop.

As for drag/drop editing. This feature is editor writing

101. I move
lines

of
code all the time. I have to do the C and A SEU thing to make that

happen

in
WDSC today. The Cut/paste function only partially works,

so I almost
never

use
it, and never use it for full lines of text.


Home.  Shift-down-arrow (once for each line to copy).  Ctrl-C or

Ctrl-insert

to copy, Ctrl-X or Shift-Delete to cut.  Move cursor to

target position.

Ctrl-V or Shift-Insert to paste.

Every one of these keystrokes is Windows standard and works in every

Windows

application -- including WDSC.

Try double-clicking on a
qualified
data structure subfield name in the calc specs, then Ctrl+C, then 
try pasting it someplace else. You don't get what you copied, you 
get the qualified DS name and that's it.


Not in my version.  When I double click, the LPEX editor marks the 
entire qualified name, including array index.  For example, I 
double-click on Bankroll in a statement using a qualifed data 
structure, and the LPEX

edit

marks "Players(iCurrentPlayer).Bankroll".  If I hit Ctrl-C

and Ctrl-V

(or

in

my case, Ctrl-Insert and Shift-Insert), that's exactly what

is copied

and pasted.

I'm used to moving the mouse to the left of the line, the pointer 
then turns and points to the "2 o'clock" position and I click to 
select the line or

click

and
drag to select multiple lines, then I move the mouse into the 
selecded area and it turns back to the 10 o'clock position and I 
drag the line(s) to a

new

location. So easy, so productive, so sexy.


That's a Microsoft Word subtlety.  It doesn't work in

Notepad, doesn't
work

in Powerpoint, doesn't work in a lot of programs.

Personally, I try to teach people to use cut and paste to the 
clipboard because it's much easier to move across a visible page 
boundary (it's

nearly

impossible to drag code from the beginning of a long

program to the end).

Also, there's a lot less chance of an accidental drop and the

corresponding

frustration.

One man's productivity is another man's annoyance.

I abandon CODE/400 because it didn't have this feature, I'll 
probably eventually abandon WDSC if it isn't added

relatively soon.


If you choose to abandon a tool because it doesn't have one of your

favorite

UI conveniences then that's your prerogative.  What are you

gonna do,
Bob,

go back to SEU?  Are you going to tell RPG developers to go back to 
SEU because WDSC is missing your favorite feature?

Or are you going to just abandon a great product that everybody is 
using because you can't drag and drop a line?


In any event, something of this fundamental a nature won't come from

WDSC,

it will have to come from the Eclipse team.  From what I understand,

Eclipse

3.3 actually has drag and drop text support, although I

haven't tested

it myself.  If you're truly worried about the future of WDSC, I 
suggest you download the latest version of Eclipse and play

with it,

and even get involved in the user community.


Joe


--
This is the Websphere Development Studio Client for iSeries  
(WDSCI-L) mailing list To post a message email: 
WDSCI-L@xxxxxxxxxxxx To subscribe, unsubscribe, or change 
list options,
visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/wdsci-l
or email: WDSCI-L-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Before posting, please take a moment to review the archives 
at http://archive.midrange.com/wdsci-l.


This e-mail transmission contains information that is intended to be 
confidential and privileged.  If you receive this e-mail and you are not a 
named addressee you are hereby notified that you are not authorized to read, 
print, retain, copy or disseminate this communication without the consent of 
the sender and that doing so is prohibited and may be unlawful.  Please reply 
to the message immediately by informing the sender that the message was 
misdirected.  After replying, please delete and otherwise erase it and any 
attachments from your computer system.  Your assistance in correcting this 
error is appreciated.