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Hans, I agree with your comments about there being some good coming out of SAA. Getting SQL and C on most platforms was goodness. (Although I gotta believe virtually no AS/400 programmers care about C, while a growing number are at least using SQL to query data, an a minority are using it for lots of cool things. I actually think all languages (except COBOL <vbg> & TIC) would be on all platforms. So where's my PL/I? :) I also realize that most of the engineering/development staff at the IBM labs weren't too interested in SAA, but some where. Weren't the mainframers proponents? Bob Cozzi cozzi@rpgiv.com Visit the on-line Midrange Developer forum at: http://www.rpgiv.com > -----Original Message----- > From: rpg400-l-admin@midrange.com [mailto:rpg400-l-admin@midrange.com] On > Behalf Of boldt@ca.ibm.com > Sent: Friday, February 15, 2002 7:50 AM > To: rpg400-l@midrange.com > Subject: Re: How do we fix IBM's "eServer" mentality? > > Bob wrote: > >With COMMON approaching in two month (www.common.org) we need to discuss > >the eServer situation and the downfall of the iSeries/AS/400 systems. > > > >Back in the 1980s a grass roots group of us decided IBM's end-all be-all > >"SAA" sucked. > >We helped kill SAA. > > > >In my view, we need to declare war on the "eServer" campaign, or start > >learning UNIX and Windows NT/2000 Server stuff. > > > >I designed a button back in the 1980s with the acronym "SAA" on it, with > >a red circle with a slash through it. "No SAA" it sad iconically. > >... > > Bob: Your memory of events 14 years ago differs somewhat from > my own. I remember SAA well. For a while, I was involved with > the effort to put RPG into the SAA arena. (When I told > management I thought SAA RPG was a bad idea, I got shuffled > into the team charged with developing the SAA RPG compiler. > Another poor stiff was then assigned the SAA duties, and later > left the company.) > > I remember the "/SAA" button. I still have one or two buried > in my stuff somewhere. Most of us here in IBM thought it was a > rather cute collectible. But did it help bury SAA? No, I don't > think so. Although the idea of complete software portability is > a mother-hood issue among us computer geeks, it can't be achieved > by top-down fiat. IBM must be a customer driven company, and the > SAA effort just had too little support both within the company > and among the customer base. In other words, the initiative > was essentially still-born right from the beginning. > > Now it's interesting to see what of the initiative has survived > into the present. Out of all the component in the 3 broad > areas of SAA (user access, programming, and communications), > there are really only three survivors with broad cross-system > support: C, COBOL, and SQL. If you want to develop a truly > cross-platform application now, there are ways. But these > techniques are all based on non-IBM systems and standards, such > as Posix and Java and TCP. > > BTW, regarding RPG (this is an RPG mailing list after all), we > all knew full well that an SAA RPG compiler was a bad idea. > But the project eventually led to a number of other new RPG > products, like VA/RPG, CODE program verifier, and ultimately > RPG IV. If it weren't for SAA, all of these tools may not have > come about. So I suppose SAA wasn't a complete waste of time. > > Also BTW, I don't think learning Unix is necessarily a bad > idea. There are a lot of good tools in that arena. > > Hans > > Hans Boldt, ILE RPG Development, IBM Toronto Lab, boldt@ca.ibm.com > > _______________________________________________ > This is the RPG programming on the AS400 / iSeries (RPG400-L) mailing list > To post a message email: RPG400-L@midrange.com > To subscribe, unsubscribe, or change list options, > visit: http://lists.midrange.com/cgi-bin/listinfo/rpg400-l > or email: RPG400-L-request@midrange.com > Before posting, please take a moment to review the archives > at http://archive.midrange.com/rpg400-l.
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