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  3. January 2015

RE: Auditor's questions Was: Active subsystems

It would be the number of possibly inane hoops you have to jump through to prove anything to a DFI or FDIC auditor who doesn't understand IT. One year we went round and round about them saying that our network diagram showed undocumented connections meaning that they were not in narrative. It came down to arguing over whether a network diagram can or should use the standard visual for two lines that are crossed on paper but not connected in reality (one of them has a half loop in it). When you waste literally hours doing that, then you adopt a don't ask don't tell approach and use as many hand-waives as possible to get them right out the door. Just to be clear that was at my former employer, where I work now, we just document everything to the nth degree and have management who understands the details to insulate the workers from the nitpicketty of the government auditors. I will also say that I have had the pleasure of working with two auditors who did understand IT, so it's not all of them, it's just most of them :-)

Coy Krill
Core Processing Administrator/Analyst
Washington Trust Bank


-----Original Message-----
From: MIDRANGE-L [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Rich Loeber
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2015 12:55
To: midrange-l@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: Auditor's questions Was: Active subsystems
Importance: Low



Hello list.

This discussion begs the question "Why are we trying to work around the auditors?"  Wouldn't it be better for the organization to work WITH the audit function?  Isn't that what the audit process is supposed to do?

Just askin'

Rich
-------------------------

Quoting "Krill, Coy" <CKrill@xxxxxxxxxxx>:

At my last employer, we relied heavily on the fact that the auditors 
only cared about compilers. We did lots of "advanced scripting", but 
no programming cuz we didn't use any compilers... I might write a 
script in Python or Groovy that manipulated data, started jobs,  ended
jobs, moved spooled files, etc. but as long as it was only  done with
a scripting language they really were not concerned and if  I was
running the script from my PC and not on the "core" then they  really
didn't care. I worked there for 10 years and that's how it  went year
after year... The part that really killed me was that they  never put
two and two together  that my SQL UDFs and Stored Procs  were compiled
into C language Service Programs by the system. Guess  it doesn't
count if I don't invoke the compiler directly.


Coy Krill
Core Processing Administrator/Analyst
Washington Trust Bank

-----Original Message-----
From: MIDRANGE-L [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
rob@xxxxxxxxx
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2015 11:11
To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion
Subject: Auditor's questions Was: Active subsystems
Importance: Low

Interesting.  So, do auditors not care if you modify anything written
in scripted languages?  Only compiled languages?  So if you store each
step for a CL program in a file, can you then modify that  file to
your hearts content and not have to worry about documenting  the
changes to the auditors?  If so, does it matter if the 'steps'  are
stored in a data file versus a source file?  If not, then can  you
just have a CRTCLPGM to 'gather' the script for execution?


Rob Berendt
--
IBM Certified System Administrator - IBM i 6.1 Group Dekko Dept
1600  Mail to:  2505 Dekko Drive
           Garrett, IN 46738
Ship to:  Dock 108
           6928N 400E
           Kendallville, IN 46755
http://www.dekko.com





From:   Roger Harman <roger.harman@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To:     Midrange Systems Technical Discussion <midrange-l@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date:   01/23/2015 01:52 PM
Subject:        RE: Active subsystems
Sent by:        "MIDRANGE-L" <midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx>



I used to drive the whole QSTRUP job from files.  Subsystems, Writers,
NEP's.  Had all the parms including delays and sequence.


Made the startup program pretty small and I never had to answer to
auditors about changes to it.



Roger Harman


COMMON Certified Application Developer ? ILE RPG on IBM i on Power

OCEAN User Grouphttp://www.ocean400.org



----------------------------------------
From: PSteinmetz@xxxxxxxxxx
To: midrange-l@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: Active subsystems
Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2015 18:02:13 +0000


Several reasons I would not depend a file to start susbsystems in
QSTRUP.
1) There could be instances where the file is not accurate.
2) The order in which subsystems start is sometimes important.
3) Some subsystem starts may need to be followed by a delay

Paul


-----Original Message-----
From: MIDRANGE-L [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
Paul Nelson
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2015 12:49 PM
To: 'Midrange Systems Technical Discussion'
Subject: RE: Active subsystems

I caught that when I reviewed the programmer's first pass at the
program(s).
:-)

We agreed to add a scheduler job to populate the active subsystem file
every day at noon. The boot programs read that file.

Paul Nelson
Cell 708-670-6978
Office 409-267-4027
nelsonp@xxxxxxxxxxxxx


-----Original Message-----
From: MIDRANGE-L [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
Steinmetz, Paul
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2015 11:35 AM
To: 'Midrange Systems Technical Discussion'
Subject: RE: Active subsystems

Paul,

How does your QSTRUP program know which subsystems to start.
None will be active following an IPL, so QSCLASBS would return an empty
list.
Am I missing something here?

Paul

-----Original Message-----
From: MIDRANGE-L [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
Paul Nelson
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2015 12:12 PM
To: 'Midrange Systems Technical Discussion'
Subject: RE: Active subsystems

I'm pleased to report that QWCLASBS is the way to go. We wrote a routine
that runs in the job scheduler at noon every day.

The boot programs read that file twice, starting the IBM subsystems
first, followed by the other subsystems.

Using that file sure simplifies the boot programs.

Thanks, all.

Paul Nelson
Cell 708-670-6978
Office 409-267-4027
nelsonp@xxxxxxxxxxxxx


-----Original Message-----
From: MIDRANGE-L [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
Gary Thompson
Sent: Tuesday, January 20, 2015 7:50 AM
To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion
Subject: RE: Active subsystems

Maybe some info from QWCLASBS - List Active Subsystems ?

-----Original Message-----
From: MIDRANGE-L [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
Paul Nelson
Sent: Tuesday, January 20, 2015 6:45 AM
To: 'Midrange Systems Technical Discussion'
Subject: Active subsystems

List,

I'm working on a project for a client to build a utility to bring their
IPL programs (32 of them) under change control. Each program will be named
the same as the box and deployed from Aldon to make the auditors happy. I
don't want to have to sift through 32 different programs to determine the
subsystems that need to be started during a reboot.

I know that TAATOOL has some commands allowing one to retrieve the
status of a subsystem and the library from which it's started, but not all
systems have that product.

Has anybody figured out a way using the standard OS to be able to write
the active subsystem information to a file and have the IPL program read
that?

Thanks

Paul Nelson
Cell 708-670-6978
Office 409-267-4027
nelsonp@xxxxxxxxxxxxx



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