RE: Some fodder for marketing, perhaps

Depending on the environment...if you're in an office environment, PCs
are swell. They're not quite as good in a dusty environment, like where
truck loading doors are open and the howling wind brings in loads of
dirt.

> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: RE: Some fodder for marketing, perhaps
> From: "Luke Dalton" <ldalton@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Date: Fri, January 06, 2006 1:12 pm
> To: "'Midrange Systems Technical Discussion'" <midrange-l@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> 
> OK.  I guess I don't understand that statement either.  I'm not trying to be
> deliberately obtuse here, but why is a dumb terminal any cheaper to maintain
> over the long run than a PC?  
> 
> Let's assume you buy a $400 Dell and load it with WinXP Pro and TN5250. If
> that PC is never connected to the web, you don't need to worry too much
> about viruses, I wouldn't' think so you could probably get by without virus
> protection or if not, load some freeware virus protection on it. 
> 
> Hard drives will spin for years without replacement.  You don't need to buy
> any extra equipment for the PC to communicate with your iSeries, that I'm
> aware of, like you do with the dumb terminal. 
> 
> I guess I'm just not understanding this argument. 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jones, John (US)
> Sent: Friday, January 06, 2006 11:51 AM
> To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion
> Subject: RE: Some fodder for marketing, perhaps
> 
> It's not the purchase price.  It's the price to maintain & administer it
> over it's useful life.  A terminal costs very little; a PC costs quite a
> lot.
> 
> -- 
> John A. Jones, CISSP
> Americas Information Security Officer
> Jones Lang LaSalle, Inc.
> V: +1-630-455-2787  F: +1-312-601-1782
> john.jones@xxxxxxxxxx
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Luke Dalton
> Sent: Friday, January 06, 2006 11:45 AM
> To: 'Midrange Systems Technical Discussion'
> Subject: RE: Some fodder for marketing, perhaps
> 
> It's been years since I priced a dumb terminal.  Just out of curiosity,
> what do they go for these days? If you can get a good basic PC for under
> $400, I can't imagine why you'd want to spend more than that on a dumb
> terminal.
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: midrange-l-bounces+ldalton=turbogorilla-software.com@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:midrange-l-bounces+ldalton=turbogorilla-software.com@xxxxxxxxxxx
> m]
> On Behalf Of Booth Martin
> Sent: Friday, January 06, 2006 11:41 AM
> To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion
> Subject: Re: Some fodder for marketing, perhaps
> 
> Two factors I have seen that prohibit PCs on the production floor are:
> 
> 1) A hostile environment.  This includes air quality, temperature
> controls, near-by moving objects from fork lifts to thrown packages, and
> workers with no love for the company or its property.
> 
> 2) Lost production while people use the PCs to play games, do personal
> stuff, and spend company time to make a case for an Internet connection
> so they can download porn, music, and surf to e Bay.
> 
> Until that changes, I can not see durable and cheap terminals
> disappearing. In fact, I would expect the direction to be toward more
> text-based stuff with bar code readers, RF ID, and all sorts of hand
> held devices.
> 
> Chuck Lewis wrote:
> > Joe,
> > 
> > No offense to you but my last job was at a very large manufacturing
> company
> > and I am now at a distribution company. In both places there are 
> > terminals in heavy use and that is NOT going to be changing anytime 
> > soon. There are areas that simply do not need PC's and what it would 
> > take to keep one running in those areas if they were needed would be 
> > basically cost prohibitive.
> > 
> > Chuck
> > 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> > [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Joe Pluta
> > Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 7:50 PM
> > To: 'Midrange Systems Technical Discussion'
> > Subject: RE: Some fodder for marketing, perhaps
> > 
> > 
> >>From: Jones, John (US)
> >>
> >>Except that IBM never marketed it as $300K off the price if you don't 
> >>want 5250.  Instead they said 5250 will cost you $300K.  So it is not 
> >>a discount for not having 5250; it is a fee for having it.
> > 
> > 
> > IBM never marketed it in any way.  But the fact is that every year 
> > processors with the same or greater power were cheaper, sometimes 
> > significantly cheaper.  It's just that the enterprise machines were
> cheaper
> > by a lesser amount.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >>The problem is that IBM took something that was built-in and thus 
> >>considered by the customer base to be 'free' and made it an option.
> > 
> > 
> > I personally find this practice reprehensible, but it's become 
> > standard in corporate America.  Give it away free until they need it 
> > and then charge
> for
> > it.  At least in this instance IBM has been clearly stating for YEARS 
> > that you need to get off the 5250.
> > 
> >  
> > 
> >>An
> >>expensive option.  Yes, they lowered the purchase price of the base 
> >>server so that it was initially something of a wash, but over time the
> 
> >>cost of 5250 has become an increasingly higher percentage of the 
> >>overall cost of a system.
> > 
> > 
> > Actually, that's not quite true.  In the initial days when there were 
> > many tiers of interactive CPW, the 100% interactive machines were 
> > sometimes
> four
> > times the cost of the zero CPW version.  Nowadays, there are only two
> > versions: with and without.
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >>Believe me, I like the platform as much as anyone on this list, but it
> 
> >>becomes increasingly difficult to sell management on the cost of 
> >>upgrades.  Things like the charge for Enterprise Edition will kill the
> 
> >>iSeries at my shop.  It is only a matter of time.
> > 
> > 
> > You could move to the browser.  Do you have source?  My product would 
> > pay for itself many times over by giving you a nearly identical look 
> > and feel
> on
> > a much smaller machine.
> > 
> > 
> > Joe
> > 
> > 
> 
> --
> -----------------------------------
> Booth Martin
> http://martinvt.com
> -----------------------------------
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