Re: Interactive vs. Batch -- MIDRANGE-L

Booth - you won't find those same MCSE's (Microsoft Certified...) at any
user group either. The books & certification is how a pc jockey can spend
a few months & a few thousand and boost their annual pay $10k (or more).
3 years ago I worked with 15 other AS400 pgmrs. We begged them to get
certified. We bought books, training cds, had evening studies, even paid a
bonus when they passed - Only 3 or 4 were interested. How do you light a
fire under a 10-15-20 year application pgmr? You'd think it was a union
job! (with apologies to any members). And you know what? There are many
AS400
certifications worth having for your career, just like MCSE. And I think
many that have them are doing very well.
Current customer-2 as400 pgmrs, 2 net techs. 400 pgmrs maintaining
ancient code. Going nowhere fast. Network guys learned linux & w2k &
frontpage on their own after hours, and now building the corp intranet.
jim


> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <booth@martinvt.com>
> To: <MIDRANGE-L@midrange.com>
> Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2001 12:26 PM
> Subject: Re: Interactive vs. Batch
>
>
> > I am not entirely convinced of the "premium price" comment.  Expensive,
> > yes, and talk about "total cost of ownership" is beginning to sound
> > hollow, but I buy into your comments 100% Nina.
> >
> > When I go into Barnes & Noble and see shelf after shelf of thick and
> > expensive books from Microsoft Press I realize these books are selling
> and
> > that the buyers are reading these books on their own time.  When was the
> > last time you saw an AS/400 shop's employees spending their own money to
> > buy 2" thick books to take home and read on their own time?  These are
> > real cost advantages for Microsoft.  How they get people to do that
> > willingly is beyond me.  On top of that, these same people fall all over
> > themselves to attend $3,500 certification classes but would think taking
> > $15 to pay dues for an AS/400 local user group meeting was exorbitant.
> >
> > My only point is that Microsoft is not cheap.  Neither is IBM. Microsoft
> > has a different and more fun-filled method for extracting their money,
> but
> > they extract it just as completely as does IBM.  IBM just doesn't know
> how
> > to do it with flair; IBM will use Interactive vs. batch as a
> > differentiator.  All that does is upset people.
> >
> > In my opinion.
> >
> > _______________________
> > Booth Martin
> > Booth@MartinVT.com
> > http://www.MartinVT.com
> > _______________________
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > nina jones <ddi@datadesigninc.com>
> > Sent by: owner-midrange-l@midrange.com
> > 04/21/2001 10:42 AM
> > Please respond to MIDRANGE-L
> >
> >
> >         To:     MIDRANGE-L@midrange.com
> >         cc:
> >         Subject:        Re: Interactive vs. Batch
> > > I think you need to look at this from a marketing perspective. IBM has
> a
> > large installed base of AS/400s running traditional green-screen
> > applications. This group of customers is used to paying premium prices
> for
> > the AS/400 platform.
> > >
> > > On the other hand, IBM needs the e(logo)server i-Series to compete
> > against other servers, such as Windows NT/2000 on Intel hardware and
> many
> > hardware platforms running UNIX/Linux. These folks do not pay premium
> > prices for anything.
> >
> >
> > i'm sure you have a point, and it's disgusting.
> >
> > what ibm does not seem to realize is that most all shops these days have
> > the p/c expert amoung them.  and they are not fans of the as/400 or ibm
> > for that matter.
> >
> > so applications are slowly being bled off the as/400 onto microsoft (or
> > other) platforms.  and any occasion to bash the as/400 and ibm is done
> > with relish.
> >
> > ibm need to realize that the old shops of total ibm loyalty are gone.
> > the old traditional applications do have their place.  forcing people to
> > pay outrageous prices for interactive sessions is not a way to inspire
> > customer loyalty!
> >
> > the way to get revenue from the as/400 is to provide the best equipment,
> > at the best price, with the best tools, and the best education.  and
> > then promote it!
> >
> > did anyone see the lastest i/series ad?  i saw it about a week ago on
> > ibm's web page.  it had an as/400 with a guy on a piece of playground
> > equipment.  y'know, the thing you spin on until you get so dizzy you
> > can't walk.
> >
> > compare that to the current microsoft ads, showing servers that don't
> > require attending, that will interface with anything.  we all know that
> > these are bold face lies, but that's what people want these days, so
> > that's what microsoft is pitching.
> >
> > but to be fair, ibm does have an ad that i like.  the brainstorming
> > session where everyone is tossing out their ideas, and a lady mentions
> > that they now have 8 or so platforms.  and the boss says 'is that a good
> > thing or a bad thing'.
> >
> > nj
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