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Good 'ole PL/I. I had heard that pointers/heap managements was sort of a kluge, that they managed that internally in QTEMP or something (This would support the Space Pointer and manipulation stuff). An IBM-er told me that it would have been really fast/great if they had opened it to native pointer manipulation. There were a lot of good feedback components accessible through PL/I that weren't fully available to RPGers. Others I have spoken with would have liked the structure of PL/I wrapped with some of the low-level components of MI. IBM must have liked that too, since S/38 was said to be written using that hybrid, called PL/MI. That wasn't an original thought. IBM Mainframe OSes had PL/S (PL/1 for Systems .. You could trot along in PL/1 for a good long way, and then you could basically say "Burp into Assembler" to perform some bit-twiddling magic. ) IBM was too concerned that we might hurt ourselves with sharp tools. ------- But thanks to several really bright people inside and outside IBM (some Bruces, some Daves, and a guy named Leif), tools and knowledge have leaked out around the edges to make some things practical that the machine is capable of. ----------------------- Oops. Sorry for the trip down memory lane.. I can just feel another grey hair popping out! -----Original Message----- From: mi400-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:mi400-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of mi400-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2004 1:01 PM To: mi400@xxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: MI400 Digest, Vol 2, Issue 125 Send MI400 mailing list submissions to mi400@xxxxxxxxxxxx To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/mi400 or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to mi400-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx You can reach the person managing the list at mi400-owner@xxxxxxxxxxxx When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of MI400 digest..." Today's Topics: 1. RE: MI compiler that supports target release (Ken Rokos) 2. RE: MI compiler that supports target release (Hewitt, Rory) 3. RE: RE: MI compiler that supports target release (Dan Bale) 4. Re: RE: MI compiler that supports target release (James H H Lampert) 5. Program references (Bobby Hicks) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- message: 1 date: Tue, 28 Sep 2004 10:03:24 -0700 from: "Ken Rokos" <Ken.Rokos@xxxxxxxx> subject: RE: [MI400] MI compiler that supports target release Don wrote: > No, PL/I isn't gone....it's still out there... I'm not exactly sure how > you get it nowadays but it is a live compiler. Looks like it's PRPQ 5799GKK. For V4Rx, it was 5799GCG. See http://www-1.ibm.com/support/docview.wss?uid=tss1fq101662 For Linux, there's an alpha version of a PL/I front end for GCC at http://sourceforge.net/projects/pl1gcc/ ------------------------------ message: 2 date: Tue, 28 Sep 2004 14:46:43 -0400 from: "Hewitt, Rory" <rory.hewitt@xxxxxx> subject: [MI400] RE: MI compiler that supports target release RE: PL/I on the AS/400... > No idea if it is still available nor if the V4 PRPQ works on V5. As far as PL/I on AS/400 goes, I currently spend about half my time writing or maintaining PL/I programs on a V5R3 box - the rest of it on RPGLE (my company (Computer Associates) has a product *now* called AllFusion 2E (but previously known as Synon/2E) that is almost entirely written in PL/I - we have several million lines of it over about 2000 programs). It looks as if the CRTPLIPGM CPP was recompiled (at least) for V5R2. > It was never a particularly good subset. As I recall, list-directed > (sort of like C stdin/stdout) and data-directed (sort of like a really > good implementation of FORTRAN's NAMELIST) I/O wasn't there, and the > terminal support was particularly lousy. If you read the AS/400 PL/I manuals, they only really seem to cover the useful-to-mainframe bits, but the general DB2/400 I/O support is excellent and you can effectively do dat-directed I/O pretty easily. It's also the best implementation of pointers I've used - far better than C or RPGLE (although space pointers only) - again, only mentioned briefly in the manuals. I've only used PL/I a little on a mainframe, so I don't know what's missing in subset G. > ILE PL/1 would be a much pleasanter environment than C (or even RPG IV or COBOL). I tried for a while to create PL/I programs, use SST to 'change' them into modules and then bind them but it never worked (sigh!). However, a combination of the PL/I run-unit and external variables (defined in the run-unti but accessible from multiple programs) can mimic some of the benefits of ILE (like simulating static binding). Coincidentally, at V5R2, the CRTPLIPGM command dropped the TGTRLS parameter, until someone made a fuss, which is why they patched it so that on a V5R3 box, you need to specify the target release in the TEXT paramater, as e.g. CRTPLIPGM PGM(MYPGM) TEXT('**V4R5M0This is my program') to create a V4R5M0-compatible programs with text name of 'This is my program'. Anyway, long story short: PL/I still alive and kicking on AS/400. We have about 3500 customers using 2E (including bits of IBM themselves!) and IBM assures us that it's not going away. Rory Rory Hewitt Software Architect Computer Associates ------------------------------ message: 3 date: Tue, 28 Sep 2004 15:25:21 -0400 from: "Dan Bale" <dbale@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> subject: RE: [MI400] RE: MI compiler that supports target release Back in my V3R1 days, IBM had a knowledge-based AI app called KnowledgeTool/400 that used PL/I to drive the "knowledge". Don't even know if that's supported anymore. db ------------------------------ message: 4 date: Tue, 28 Sep 2004 13:17:11 -0700 (PDT) from: "James H H Lampert" <jamesl@xxxxxxxxxxx> subject: Re: [MI400] RE: MI compiler that supports target release > Coincidentally, at V5R2, the CRTPLIPGM command dropped the TGTRLS > parameter, until someone made a fuss, which is why they patched it so > that on a V5R3 box, you need to specify the target release in the TEXT > paramater, as e.g. CRTPLIPGM PGM(MYPGM) TEXT('**V4R5M0This is my > program') to create a V4R5M0-compatible programs with text name of 'This > is my program'. I'm surprised that, in dropping the TGTRLS parameter, they didn't simply have it compile to V1R3-compatibility (especially given how old the compiler is). That's the only circumstance under which I'd accept the lack of a TGTRLS parameter. -- JHHL ------------------------------ message: 5 date: Wed, 29 Sep 2004 08:31:50 -0400 from: Bobby Hicks <Robert.Hicks@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> subject: [MI400] Program references I am using the OIR to retrieve a list of program references. I have come across the following problem. I have data area references with a type of 0B30(which is invalid) in one program and 190A (which is valid) in another program. How is this possible and what am I missing? Bobby. ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ This is the MI Programming on the AS400 / iSeries (MI400) digest list To post a message email: MI400@xxxxxxxxxxxx To subscribe, unsubscribe, or change list options, visit: http://lists.midrange.com/mailman/listinfo/mi400 or email: MI400-request@xxxxxxxxxxxx Before posting, please take a moment to review the archives at http://archive.midrange.com/mi400. End of MI400 Digest, Vol 2, Issue 125 *************************************
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