Well, I'm not sure where you get the data to populate your database Milt,
but Infor claimed to us that they had over 10,000 installations. That
would certainly show some shrink, but not 90%.

Bryce Martin
Programmer/Analyst I

"Milt" <mhabeck@xxxxxxxxxx>
Sent by: bpcs-l-bounces+bmartin=c-sgroup.com@xxxxxxxxxxxx
12/07/2010 12:38 PM
Please respond to
BPCS ERP System <bpcs-l@xxxxxxxxxxxx>

"BPCS user group" <bpcs-l@xxxxxxxxxxxx>

[BPCS-L] ~ 90% BPCS customer shrink // IBM i v6r1 + 4.05CD + ERP LX +


Back in the 1997-98 era, SSA claimed roughly >16,500 BPCS customers (or
they meant installed sites ... that was never made clear). It's far from
precise math, but based on movements in the contact database we use to
our ERP LX + BPCS bolt-ons and services, I'll take a wild guess there are
less than 1,750 installed BPCS + ERP LX sites still standing. Shucks.

In my humble opinion, part of that 90% shrink has to be laid at the door
how SSA/SSA-GT/Infor (INFOR) negotiate(d) with their customers. I have
heard dozens of first-party testimonies about flamboyant charges and fees
invented by INFOR .... invented from thin air. I recall one company
at a furniture place who was enormously infuriated by the bill for a new
He decided to leave BPCS at that moment. I think there's still a dent in
office ceiling right below where he first saw the quote.

The old SSA software license agreements I've seen promise "perpetual
enjoyment" of the software. That promise was made into a market which has
always been typified by machine churning and operating system upgrades.
SLAs carry no language about charging for a key ..... and if challenged in
courtroom, I don't think a judge would invent that language. Judges
contracts or throw contracts out .... they don't write new lines into
contracts. Doesn't "perpetual enjoyment" include supporting moves like
to RISC and v5 to v6? Shucks.

I am NOT an attorney .... but in my experience ..... companies which
legal research in response to a flamboyant INFOR quote end up with a much,
much better $ deal. INFOR doesn't want a legal precedent. And, they know
an action ends up filed, a court would grant temporary
injunctions/fixes/key(s) pending resolution on the grounds of
enterprise employment continuity. Contact me off-line for details.

Net/net .... the implosion of the BPCS base has been a very sad thing for
to witness. Unbeaten Path was founded 19.x years ago to help BPCS users.
hard to prosper when 90% of the market disappears. So, strategically we
go elsewhere. A clever/unique new product we've invented for IBM i/iSeries
now slated for installation at an alpha site. (The functionality of the
product is in no way limited to just INFOR's product line)

If your company is thinking of going elsewhere too, here's some practical
tips on "how to escape BPCS well" --->

Warm regards and Merry Christmas,

Milt Habeck
Unbeaten Path
(888) 874-8008

P.S. --- if you want to hear details about the critical turning points
that, in my opinion, decisively changed SSA's trajectory

(BPCS v6.0.0.0 and v7.0.0.0), give me a ring.


From: rob@xxxxxxxxx
Sent: Tuesday, December 07, 2010 9:47 AM
To: BPCS ERP System
Subject: Re: [BPCS-L] IBM i 6.1 and 405CD

Why are you suggesting that? Are you hoping there's strength in numbers
get BPCS to lower their upgrade prices? I can just see them shuddering
"Let's see, company XYZ hasn't spent a dime with us in 5 years and now
are saying they want free a free upgrade because of that. While company
has paid their maintenance diligently." I suppose a counter argument
be made that if you can get a nickel out of XYZ in upgrade fees that's
than nothing. However, you still make company ABC look like an idiot for
paying maintenance.

Don't make Infor the heavy here. It was the user's management that was
penny wise and pound foolish. It was their IT department that didn't take
advantage of something they were already paying for and call Infor on a
periodic basis and report problems and take advantage of their maintenance

And, it will be the company buying them that will seriously ding them
the due diligence phase for allowing their software and hardware to get so
out of date. The buying company is going to know they will be hit with
upgrade charges.
Hardware should be leased, maintained and upgraded regularly.

Rob Berendt
Group Dekko

From: "Carr, Wally"
To: BPCS ERP System
Date: 12/07/2010 10:25 AM
Subject: Re: [BPCS-L] IBM i 6.1 and 405CD
Sent by: bpcs-l-bounces+rob=dekko.com@xxxxxxxxxxxx

I think your client might want to look at biting the bullet and getting
off BPCS entirely.

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