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On Jun 13, 2018, at 3:22 PM, Jeff Crosby <jlcrosby@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
"IF (and I emphasize IF) you use the cycle as nature intended it is not a
problem and works well . . . "
That's my point.
On Wed, Jun 13, 2018 at 10:14 AM, Jon Paris <jon.paris@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
I'm with Jim on this one. I would add that my dislike of the cycle began
in earnest while trying to maintain a program where the programmer had
spent more energy on fighting the cycle to get the program to do what he
wanted that he did anything else.
IF (and I emphasize IF) you use the cycle as nature intended it is not a
problem and works well - but all too often over time the requirements
change and the code gets into "fight" mode. I'd rather have a piece of
code that anyone can understand than rely on a knowledge of an arcane
feature that has more in common with punch cards than with today's
application needs.
Jon Paris
www.partner400.com
www.SystemiDeveloper.com
On Jun 13, 2018, at 2:30 PM, Jim Oberholtzer <midrangel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
skill
SQL is a language unto itself requiring a separate set of skills that
combined with most any programming language today that use a relational
database means you can manipulate data as needed. I see SQL as a core
in todays' world, with the potential exception of the larger noSQLlanguage
databases.
As to the earlier comment that we should not use any feature in a
that's not available in all other languages, that's taking the concept toall
absurdity. They cycle has not been taught or commonly used in new
development in some time, aside from the quick utility programs that we
occasionally write. Do you intentionally use program described filesand
output specs in new development, ignoring the fact that SQL and otheryou'll be
programs could not access the data easily? No because we have moved past
those days. The cycle is in the same category.
Use the cycle if you wish, it's efficient and reasonably easy for simple
read, process, write programs. Then plan on never retiring, since
the only one to be able to maintain it.Alan
--
Jim Oberholtzer
Agile Technology Architects
-----Original Message-----
From: MIDRANGE-L [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
Shorewas
Sent: Wednesday, June 13, 2018 7:52 AM
To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion <midrange-l@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: RE: [EXTERNAL] RE: the cycle that never ends
Hi Jim
Even though Im not a fan of the cycle, I don't agree with this comment I
a mainframe COBOL programmer when I was given a couple of manuals for thelater -
AS/400 and told - here, learn this I was doing okay until I came across a
program that had no reads of a file Sent me up the wall - until days
I finally saw the p in the f-spec THAT was my introduction of the cyclefellow
Traumatized me so much I even have flashbacks Oh the terror
Anyway, I use embedded SQL and I know there are quite a number of my
compadres have a problem with SQL - period Because of that, should Inever
use embedded SQL?Jim
Alan Shore
E-mail : ASHORE@xxxxxxxx
Phone [O] : (631) 200-5019
Phone [C] : (631) 880-8640
'If you're going through hell, keep going.'
Winston Churchill
-----Original Message-----
From: MIDRANGE-L [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
Oberholtzerworld
Sent: Wednesday, June 13, 2018 8:37 AM
To: 'Midrange Systems Technical Discussion' <midrange-l@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [EXTERNAL] RE: the cycle that never ends
Since no other language has the cycle (that I'm aware of) in today's
where you might not be the one to maintain the program, more currentlyyour
traditional styles of managing I/O is vastly preferred. Regardless of
adoration for the cycle, it's no longer commonly used. Sure it's easy inschool
the right circumstance, however 99.5% of the students coming out of
have never seen a cycle program. That makes it your problem, nottheirs, to
make sure they can maintain what you built.James
--
Jim Oberholtzer
Agile Technology Architects
-----Original Message-----
From: MIDRANGE-L [mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
H. H. Lamperttheir
Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2018 1:19 PM
To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion <midrange-l@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: the cycle that never ends
On 6/12/18, 10:42 AM, dmmueller@xxxxxxx wrote:
and should I be embarrassed to say, we still have some of those cycle
programs still running.... and with each upgrade, they still work :)
Nothing to be embarrassed about.
What should be embarrassing is when people AVOID using The Cycle in
situations where it is the correct tool for the job . . . and end up
"walking" through a file when they can "ride" through it (or writing
own "do until the user exits" loop when, simply by tying LR to whateverthe
user does to exit, e.g., tying it to INKC, they can use a built-inlist
event-loop).
--
JHHL
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Jeff Crosby
VP Information Systems
UniPro FoodService/Dilgard
P.O. Box 13369
Ft. Wayne, IN 46868-3369
260-422-7531
direct.dilgardfoods.com
The opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily the opinion of my
company. Unless I say so.
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