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$50,000 is not conservative; it's probably about right. "Investment opportunities" at $50,000/year? Who's passing out the free drugs? A decent car costs half of your before-tax salary...the best investment opportunity is to save and pay cash for the car. Here's the real equation: College may or may not be 10K. Thousands put themselves through college without going into debt. Maybe it takes 5 years and a big part-time job but they do it. So let's say the 50K career stagnates for 5 years while doing the college thing, and let's assume a 25-year working career (I'm assuming your "investment opportunities" make @ 50K pan out!). If you're making 50K degree-less, you'll make *at least* double that with a degree. So, in 25 years you'll be above the $2,500,000 gross earning mark, way better that 30 years @ 50K (I'm leaving out the fact that a 6% raise at 100K is a lot better than a 6% raise at 50K). You're going to have to learn something new some day and a degree including study of the important stuff (business and technical writing, critical reading, statistics, economics, finance, marketing, accounting, and psychology) proves you're more than a very good technician. It proves you can learn in a formal environment and it strengthens your "language" (English, among others) skills. Did you know that Classics (Latin, Greek) majors make remarkably good programmers? I don't know why; they're either grateful for a job or their mental skills have been refined by working in other "languages". Your college instructors won't know every detail of network management or programming you may know...but they'll know way more overall. College is not about learning facts (unless you're in accounting or premed); it's about learning how to think and reason. It's an accomplishment, it's an international common denominator, and it's a door-opener. If you want to stay at being a very good technician, don't go to college. College isn't right for everybody, but if you're capable of growing in an IT career without a degree, you can handle it. Just remember many of your college courses will seem pointless! College offers new opportunities in areas you might not have considered. You'll make contacts (instructors and students; instructors often have consulting gigs and need skilled help) and hopefully some lifelong friends. You'll meet recruiters at college; the fact you made the effort and went back will impress the kind of people you want to work with and work for. College does not automatically mean "management". What is means is you can choose your own path. There are lots of other considerations here for Justin: what do his parents think about college, does he live at home, and has he considered enlisting in the military (G.I. benefits are pretty good)? Other suggestions previously posted (Dale Carnegie, writing) have merit. >From my own perspective (B.A., M.B.A.) the real mileage that comes out of a degree is being able to relate better to your peers, supervisors, and customers (both internal and external). When you ask a question that shows an understanding of someone else's area of expertise, you've just gained credibility. You don't need a degree to do this, but it's not likely you're going to learn the "important stuff" (above) where you are now. Justin, if you don't go to college, the best thing you can do is make a commitment to learning about the world around you. There's more to life than programming...at least, that's what I've been told! My professional path allows me to work half days...and I get to pick which twelve hours. -Reeve -----Original Message----- From: midrange-l-admin@midrange.com [mailto:midrange-l-admin@midrange.com]On Behalf Of M. Lazarus Sent: Sunday, June 30, 2002 12:31 PM To: midrange-l@midrange.com Subject: RE: Experience vs College Degree Phil, At 6/28/02 04:19 PM, you wrote: >At age 21, definately get a degree. Even if you have to quit your current >job. >You have no idea what opportunities may present themselves by going to >college. I would like to play devil's advocate, from a practical financial standpoint. Let's take a look at some numbers. Assuming a local college, no out of state fees, no dorming costs and conservative tuition, let's say $10,000 per year (don't forget books, student fees, etc.) He's quit his job, so there's no income. Let's say he's making (again conservatively) $50,000 per year. School costs: 4 x 10,000 = 40,000 Lost income: 4 x 50,000 = 200,000 ------- $240,000 + any interest due for your student loans. Also lost is the interest or other investment opportunities from the income flow. And what about the 4 years of real world business and technical experience that he will lose out on? I would rather hire someone w/ 5 years experience than 1 year + a degree. What other hardships will be encountered due to the lack of income? Remember that Justin has a mortgage and probably some other responsibilities. So, after 4 years, he'll be out roughly a quarter of a million dollars for the dubious advantage of: "You have no idea what opportunities may present themselves by going to college." How long will it take to make up the difference??? I'm not saying that Justin should not go. I'm just saying that it's not the panacea that seems to be the popular sentiment in this group. My opinion is that it's much more practical (since you already have a job!) to enhance your value in the field by going to educational opportunities such as Common, or taking some additional programming courses such as Java or ILE concepts (if you can find one near you!), etc. You can probably show your employer that he would get a reasonable ROI if he sent you to those, so you may get paid time and the course paid for. It's a win-win for you and your employer. JMHO. -mark _______________________________________________ This is the Midrange Systems Technical Discussion (MIDRANGE-L) mailing list To post a message email: MIDRANGE-L@midrange.com To subscribe, unsubscribe, or change list options, visit: http://lists.midrange.com/cgi-bin/listinfo/midrange-l or email: MIDRANGE-L-request@midrange.com Before posting, please take a moment to review the archives at http://archive.midrange.com/midrange-l.
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