Re: IBM RationalWebDeveloper forWebsphere SoftwareVersion 6.0

IBM is already doing this ... they now have the "free" WDSCi (which you paid
for as part of the WebSphere Development Studio development tools "bundle"
that includes SEU, PDM, all the compilers, etc.), but now, if you want to
use some of the neat new features like Single-Sign-On enablement for
web-faced applications, the ability to web-face and use certain "system"
commands (such as WRKSPLF) in your web-faced application, etc., you MUST
license the "WDSCi - Advanced Edition" -- and this costs serious money, "per
seat"...

This is all being driven by "Software Group" -- that is the part of IBM that
includes Toronto Labs. Let IBM know how you feel about this.

----- Original Message -----
> From: "Kelly Cookson" <KCookson@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: "Websphere Development Studio Client for iSeries"
<wdsci-l@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Friday, November 05, 2004 8:48 AM
> Subject: RE: [WDSCI-L] IBM RationalWebDeveloper forWebsphere
SoftwareVersion 6.0
>

> Surely IBM would not try to add a license fee at this stage of the
studio's development. Problems due to the studio's immaturity (crashes,
installation problems, bugs, and slow performance are still too frequent)
would make the studio a hard sell if it carried an additional fee. I think
the studio needs to mature more before it can succeed as a separately
licensed product. And maybe by then it will be impressive enought that
people don't mind paying the fee.
>
> Kelly
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: wdsci-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:wdsci-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Mark Phippard
> Sent: Friday, November 05, 2004 9:28 AM
> To: Websphere Development Studio Client for iSeries
> Subject: RE: [WDSCI-L] IBM Rational WebDeveloper forWebsphere
> SoftwareVersion 6.0
>
>
> I worry a little about this too, because I bet whomever was responsibile
> for making WDSC "free" had to pull some strings to do so.  With Rational
> likely responsible for showing their own contribution to the IBM bottom
> line these "strings" could be cut and could go away.
>
> Here is why I do not think it will happen though:
>
> 1)  I believe the iSeries people are committed to this and do what it
> takes to continue it.  The same thing happened to them with WebSphere AS,
> and by adopting Tomcat in OS/400 as a response they showed the WebSphere
> people they are serious.  Lo and behold, we get WAS Express in the next
> release.
>
> 2)  IBM could always change the WDSC offering slightly.  For example, WDSC
> could be based more on the Eclipse-base, instead of WSSD.  This would
> remove some of the tooling we have today but still give us the core of
> what we want.  There could then be a small upgrade fee to the full tools
> and a larger fee for the advanced tools.
>
> 3)  IBM recently contributed the majority of their web tools to
> Eclipse.org.  So in the near future you will be able to get 90-95% of WSSD
> as a free Eclipse offering.  This makes #2 that much easier for the
> iSeries folks as a fallback option.
>
> I actually think that WDSC might be a better product if IBM took this
> latter approach.  It is nice that the people that need the tools in WSSD
> and WSAD get those tools as part of WDSC, but I think the underlying
> packaging involved in doing it that way somewhat handcuffs the WDSC
> developers in the way that they deliver the product.  They could probably
> produce a cleaner offering if they were just in complete control of the
> packaging.
>
> Mark
>
>
> wdsci-l-bounces+markp=softlanding.com@xxxxxxxxxxxx wrote on 11/05/2004
> 10:12:24 AM:
>
> > With the introduction of Rational into the developers toolbox does
> > anyone foresee IBM trying to make these development tools "additional
> > charges" even if you have a compiler license?  I am just curious because
> > it would seem that the adoption of Rational products (which
> > automatically trigger $$ in my mind) might mean IBM would start
> > charging.  Hopefully it doesn't turn into the mess that happened with
> > charging for WAS Express.
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: wdsci-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:wdsci-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx]
> >
> > Sent: Friday, November 05, 2004 9:00 AM
> > To: Websphere Development Studio Client for iSeries
> > Subject: RE: [WDSCI-L] IBM Rational Web Developer forWebsphere
> > SoftwareVersion 6.0
> >
> > Correct, it is the same basic product lines with new branding.  While we
> > are all tired of the constant name changes, a lot of us have complained
> > in the past that the "WebSphere" brand was used on too many products and
> > made things confusing.  So I do not really mind them using the
> > "Rational" brand to apply to their development tools.  AFAIK, WDSC is
> > going to remain WDSC for at least the next release.  I have not heard of
> > any plans to apply the Rational brand to it, although that would make
> > some sense for consistency.
> >
> > I imagine that more of the tools that came from Rational will start to
> > make their way into the base offerings.  Rational still has their own
> > packages based on Eclipse that focus on their modelling and testing
> > tools.
> >  Perhaps more "lite" versions of some of these features will make their
> > way into the WSSD/WSAD tools?
> >
> > When all is said and done, this will just be the Eclipse 3.x-based
> > version of the same tools we have been using.
> >
> > Mark
> >
> >
> > wdsci-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx wrote on 11/05/2004 10:07:01 AM:
> >
> > > >From what I can tell from the screen shots it looks like the Rational
> > > brand will be applied to the WSSD/WSAD/WDSC line, as opposed to the
> > > Rational products replacing WebSphere Studio.  From what I've read
> > > (both from IBM and from other sources), the Rational products weren't
> > > particularly productive.
> > >
> > > Joe
> > >
> > > > From: Mark Phippard
> > > >
> > > > It will likely be the foundation for WDSC 6.0.
> >
> >
> > ________________________________________________________________________

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