Joe- speaking of wasting time, why did you not just post a link to your demo
application?
If you want real comments on that demo, the 5250 style emulation is well done,
and the web browser-looking "IQ" implementation ain't bad. Either one took a
second or two display when pages changed. (And no, I'm on a 10 megabyte per
second dedicated Ethernet drop connected over SONNET. And on a dual processor
dual core machine to avoid any accusations of trying it on a machine that was
not sufficiently fast to display it quickly.)
While I understand those are just quick demo applications, neither one would
get into production here because the UI is not polished enough. The speed would
be quite acceptable for that kind of inquiry application. We deliver similar
capabilities over the web, primiarly using CGI programs, with similar response
times.
But neither your demo nor the applications we publish on the web are the type
of stuff we put users in front of for hours per day, doing customer service,
call center, or data entry work. Those kinds of applications are still better
served by either green screen, or better yet, local GUI applications.
All of which are just as easy to develop as a web application. Easier in fact.
You seem to be thinking I am trying to challenge you or something, and keep
coming up with less than polite comments about "wasting your time." I think the
problem here is you are simply missing a few facts. For example, your
assertation that things run slower over Citrix is just plain false.
Why don't you go over to this link and try a few applications?
http://www.citrixtestdrive.com/testdrive/
Note that the system will not only run the application for you, but it sets up
an individual deployment environment in real time.
Further, most sites never see the initial "I'm setting you up delay" because
one the applications are loaded on a server, there is no setup to work through.
And most sites use a dedicated client, not the much clunkier web client you can
see here.
By the way, terminal emulators like Client Access work under Citrix too, and
they work very quickly.
-Paul
From: Paul Raulerson
I'm not trying to be either difficult or confusing. Rather, I asked you
for a sample of a Web Application that has subsecond response.
And I tried to explain that the issue is not the application, it's the UI.
You continue to waste time.
You would have to be at one of my client's sites to see a live version, or
you could go to my website (
http://www.plutabrothers.com/PBDWeb/p1e.html)
and see the live demo there. Of course, you'll complain that the demo on my
site doesn't do complex enough processing, which is where you are being
difficult.
And of course, Aaron just told you he saw it live.
But I would simply have to see one first.
So rather than continue to drag this out, simply go to my website. Run the
demo. See that it gives sub-second response time. Then come back and tell
us why else it doesn't meet your requirements.
At the same time, please point us to a working application that meets those
same requirements running Citrix or better yet NX that we can test.
I have seen fast JSP applications, but the repsonse speed from these
applications is subject to, and limited by, the client and the network. In
other words, the browser has to render the page and load/interept the
Javascript. That takes a good deal of time to do anything significant.
On a WAN, the transmission time is negligible, and the rendering time on a
workstation is just as fast if not faster for HTML than it is for X-Windows
type of interfaces. In fact, every the thin client solutions I've seen over
the Internet all perform MUCH slower than a browser.
But we'll just compare with the Citrix application you show us.
WebSphere deployment can
and does add significantly to that cost, as you need WebSphere, databases
and the cost of Rational included in there.
Paul, I think you might be missing a few facts. WebSphere, the database and
WDSC are all free for iSeries shops.
Joe
midrange.com
