RE: Should users have a say in the software development Re:Shouldusers have a say in the software development

There's a lot of truth in what you are saying here. I do want to point out
one nit with your rant, and that is the bit about "years on the job, etc.."
because I have seen many times, and in fact, just in the last six months,
supposed "experts" in the industry with one having 22 years and other 28
years RPG programming experience who were programming at a junior programmer
level with 3-4 years experience...unable to figure out very basic RPG syntax
errors and totally lost on anything above RPGIII.   The certification is one
good help towards remedying that, but then you have people who are really
good at taking tests but absolutely suck at real-world application of the
material. I don't know what the solution might be but one thing that I would
do if I was contemplating hiring someone would be to pay them to come in for
a week, even if it was on nights and weekend when they had free time, and
have them actually do some programming work for me on one or two projects to
see if they can really do what they say. The proof of someone's abilities is
not in what they say or their ability to take a test, it's in whether or not
they can really write code the way you want it done. 



-----Original Message-----
From: midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:midrange-l-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
mark.s.waterbury@xxxxxxx
Sent: Monday, March 20, 2006 11:10 AM
To: Midrange Systems Technical Discussion
Subject: RE: Should users have a say in the software development
Re:Shouldusers have a say in the software development

<RANT>
In my opinion, the "real" problem is that the IT industry is, and always has
been, rife with unqualified and untrained people calling themselves
"professionals" and they often do a poor job, or worse. (I personally know
of several companies that have gone bankrupt as a direct result of the total
incompetence of their IT "consultants".) This tarnishes our collective
reputations, and may be one reason why Microsoft succeeds in selling the
idea that users can "do it for themselves" rather than relying on an IT
department in "the glass house" etc.

In reality, if we ever want our IT industry to be perceived as truly
"professional", like Doctors, Lawyers or Engineers, then we as an industry
need to require a certain level of professional education, plus some number
of years of "on-the-job" training (apprenticeship), followed by
"Certification" ... consider how engineers must attend 4 years of college,
and graduate with a BS degree, then work on the job for something like 7
years, and then must pass the Professional Engineers (PE) exam, before
becoming a fully licensed Engineer.  Similarly, Doctors or Lawyers must go
through seven years of college, plus some kind of internship, before
becoming licensed or certified to practice.  I think you should have to be
licensed to be practising in the field of "Software Engineering."

Today, most software developers, systems analysts and applications
programmers were never formally educated in software engineering, but in
some other field, and were trained "on-the-job" if at all. So, they build
software systems the way the Wright brothers built airplanes -- build it,
then push it off a cliff to see if it flies.

In the IT industry today, anyone can buy a PC and "cobble together" several
programs using whatever tools, and sell his/her "software" or services! And,
consider that, in many cases, software is now being used to control
mission-critical systems or make life-or-death decisions (such as HMOs using
software to decide whether a given patient deserves coverage for a given
treatment procedure recommended by his/her doctor). 
</RANT>

The news is full of horror stories related to software failures that can
have devastating consequences.  See http://www.origsoft.com/nightmares.htm
for just a few examples.


 -------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "Walden H. Leverich" <WaldenL@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >Of course, if it weren't for "those darned users" "needs" our jobs
> would
> >not be needed, either   :-)
> 
> Don't confuse a user's needs with the user's ability/right to be
> involved in the design and construction of a solution to those needs. 
> 
> If not for sick patients doctors would be out of a job, but we go to a
> doctor and say "I fell out of a tree and my arm hurts." He determines
> that it is broken, what the right way to fix it is (cast, sling,
> surgery) and he implements the solution. We don't go to the doctor and
> say "I fell out of a tree, I need you to put on a 1/2 length fiberglass
> cast with pins supporting the bilateral bone plate and I need 250mg of
> Vicoden for pain." 
> 
> He's the professional, we let him do his job. Somewhere along the line
> users have forgotten (we've allowed them to forget) that we actually get
> paid because we know what we're talking about. We're the professional,
> let us do our job.
> 
> -Walden
> 
> ------------
> Walden H Leverich III
> Tech Software
> (516) 627-3800 x3051
> WaldenL@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> http://www.TechSoftInc.com
> 
> Quiquid latine dictum sit altum viditur.
> (Whatever is said in Latin seems profound.)
> 
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