Re: the ASSET issue again

We have been using As/Set in its various flavors for about 8 years now.  We
started on BPCS version 2.1 on the AS/400 and As/Set at the same time.  We
even tried to use As/Set IWS from version 1.0 through a couple more
horrible releases of that product.  We have yet to ever receive ODW which
we were told we were entitled to when we upgraded to 6.x.  At this point in
time, I don't want it.

With regards to As/Set.  We have found development to be generally faster.
The generated RPG programs are larger and do execute generally slower than
a stock RPG program.  We have found this to be especially true with batch
programs.

BPCS programs are horrible to look at in either form.  Even in version 2.1,
the RPG code was nasty (in my opinion) due to their naming and strange use
(again, my opinion) of work fields.  When SSA started coding everything in
As/Set, they were able to code ugly looking As/Set code as well.   Things
that should be simple were coded overly complex.

When we have used As/Set for development outside of BPCS, the Action
diagrams are nice in some cases.  But, now with RPG ILE with its more free
form format and longer variable names, the As/Set action diagrams have lost
some of their appeal.

As/Set has been a good tool for us.  Unfortunately we have allowed our more
"pure" RPG skills deteriorate.  It has also been very difficult hiring
programmers over the years.

I have mixed feelings about the tool being dropped.  But, I have mixed
feelings about SSA in general as of late.  I am not sure they are a company
I am willing to recommend our company depends on in the future.

Just my two cents.

Dwight Slessman
BPCS 6.04 Mixed Mode on AS/400 V4R2



                                                                                
                                
                    "Nick"                                                      
                                
                    <nick@galaxy.lt        To:     <BPCS-L@midrange.com>        
                                
                    d.uk>                  cc:                                  
                                
                    Sent by:               Subject:     Re: the ASSET issue 
again                               
                    owner-bpcs-l@mi                                             
                                
                    drange.com                                                  
                                
                                                                                
                                
                                                                                
                                
                    09/18/2000                                                  
                                
                    09:39 AM                                                    
                                
                    Please respond                                              
                                
                    to BPCS-L                                                   
                                
                                                                                
                                
                                                                                
                                



I beg to differ. In my opinion ASSET creates RPG source which is larger by
a
huge amount than that which a competent RPG programmer would code. I also
believe that the compiled object is much larger and runs more slowly.Anyone
agree with me?

Nick

----- Original Message -----
From: "Lacelle, Marc" <LACELLE@rcmint.ca>
To: <BPCS-L@midrange.com>
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2000 1:49 PM
Subject: RE: the ASSET issue again


> Hi Ho.
>
> I for one use ASSET/ADK as a development tool and find it quite
> useful. I am not an RPG or RPG-ILE programmer and never intend on being
one.
> ASSET/ADK offers is a simple alternative to RPG. You almost can do
> everything with this tool. Yes, RPG is more powerful but,  a program
written
> using ASSET will take the same amount of time to run as a program written
in
> RPG. The code generated from a program using Asset will be much smaller
than
> a program written using RPG, it will take me a few days to come up with a
> complex ASSET/ADK program where it may take a week or more using RPG.
>
> If the execution time for a program is the same and the length in
> time to write the code using ASSET is lesser than RPG. Why knock the
> product.
>
> You are correct in the saying that the source provided by SSA for
> BPCS is pretty bad. We call it spaghetti language over here, but lets not
> forget SSA are in the business of making money. If they had two line
source
> for every program they had, we would not need them.
>
> PS: It think the people who dislike ASSET are RPG programmers.
>
> Marc Lacelle
> Royal Canadian Mint
>
>
>
> > ----------
> > From: Chick Doe[SMTP:Cdoe@barton-instruments.com]
> > Reply To: BPCS-L@midrange.com
> > Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2000 3:32 PM
> > To: BPCS-L@midrange.com
> > Subject: the ASSET issue again
> >
> > there's been a lot said in the last couple of days about SSA and
AS/SET.
> > while i am not a fan of it, i can understand the logic of writing code
in
> > AS/SET that could then be compiled and run on multiple environments.
yes
> > you will sacrifice performance, but if the intent was to provide
improved
> > functionality at less cost, then i can understand the logic. whether
this
> > was ever delivered or not is another question.
> >
> > but what drives me absolutely insane is SSA's practice of commenting
out
> > lines in both the AS/SET source and in the resulting RPG source. much o
> > the complexity in trying to read these damn programs is just trying to
> > decipher which lines are still executable statements and which are now
> > comments. my guess is that well over half of all statements in their
> > programs are old lines of code that are now comments. TAKE THEM OUT AND
> > GIVE US SOURCE PROGRAMS THAT CAN BE READ!
> >
> > chick doe
> > barton instrument systems
> >
> > +---
> > | This is the BPCS Users Mailing List!
> > | To submit a new message, send your mail to BPCS-L@midrange.com.
> > | To subscribe to this list send email to BPCS-L-SUB@midrange.com.
> > | To unsubscribe from this list send email to
BPCS-L-UNSUB@midrange.com.
> > | Questions should be directed to the list owner: dasmussen@aol.com
> > +---
> >
> +---
> | This is the BPCS Users Mailing List!
> | To submit a new message, send your mail to BPCS-L@midrange.com.
> | To subscribe to this list send email to BPCS-L-SUB@midrange.com.
> | To unsubscribe from this list send email to BPCS-L-UNSUB@midrange.com.
> | Questions should be directed to the list owner: dasmussen@aol.com
> +---

+---
| This is the BPCS Users Mailing List!
| To submit a new message, send your mail to BPCS-L@midrange.com.
| To subscribe to this list send email to BPCS-L-SUB@midrange.com.
| To unsubscribe from this list send email to BPCS-L-UNSUB@midrange.com.
| Questions should be directed to the list owner: dasmussen@aol.com
+---




+---
| This is the BPCS Users Mailing List!
| To submit a new message, send your mail to BPCS-L@midrange.com.
| To subscribe to this list send email to BPCS-L-SUB@midrange.com.
| To unsubscribe from this list send email to BPCS-L-UNSUB@midrange.com.
| Questions should be directed to the list owner: dasmussen@aol.com
+---